It now seems all but certain Shatner and Nimoy will appear in ST XI. It seems very likely they will have to appear post nexus. They have cleary aged far too much for this film to be pre-generations.
Let me be the first (or one of the first) to predict that part of JJ Abrahms ST XI is too bring Kirk out of the nexus alive and well.
I predict the last scene in ST XI will be the older versions of Kirk and Spock walking off into the sunset as the hero's we remember.
That will be the best of both worlds for everyone. And lead to a much bigger box office.
So, three years of a five year mission, a cancelled TV series, and an animated series and dozens of books that most wouldn't necessarily consider cannon in TOS universe.
I still blanch at the thought of an academy related movie. First Kirk-Spock meetings? The first season's episodes were kinda icy, and didn't have McCoy.
Why not carry on with a movie based in year 4 of the mission? Hey, all the characters, our favorite Enterprise, a rash of material to work off of (Lord, to see the Kzinti from the animated series) and, hopefully the chemistry among actors/crew members that made TOS the cult show it is.
Shatner and Nimoy giving their approval would be great, but their involvment in the movie, however brief, could easily overshadow any hopes new actors have of making these roles their own.
I remember a while back Harv Bennett pitched this idea. Funny how everybody says the same things Harv did, but leaving his name out of it. Harv got screwed before after pitching this and now he's getting screwed because everyone thinks this Abrams fellow is the hot sh**. I'm sure everyone enjoyed his over hyped MI-3. Hear MI-3 might break even if dvd sales are in the range of the Bible.
I have not paid attention to Star Trek for a long time.
Shatner and Nimoy' return is the only thing that would get me to come back.
Great job Mr Abrahms.
Great News!!
This is wonderful news. Amazing news.
For Leonard Nimoy - who always stated that he was retired from STAR TREK and happy not acting - to suddenly express interest in playing Spock again alongside Shatner's Kirk gives me hope fo the JJ Arams film.
Even as "bookends" to the film, as cameos, they could inject some class, dignity and some nostalgia into the proceedings. I think it's a great idea, because what I am sensing now is that this film isn't just about missions at the academy, its about friendship, memory, loyalty, growth.
The CGI "make-up" done for Patrick Stewart and Ian McKellan in X3 could do the trick. In a year or so, that technology might even be more refined. Pick your era...pre-Generations Kirk & Spock cameo?... voila (although digitally editing Shatner's weight may be a taller order).
There is no evidence that Shatner and Nimoy will be asked to reprise their roles. Nimoy is just guessing. It could still be a reboot with the two actors playing some other part so as to still cash in on their popularity.
Heck maybe it's STTNNNG and the enw cast is having a K/S flashback. WHatever it is it can't be worse than the Star Wars prequels :)
This is great news, although I'm guessing when they say the movie will be focused on younger characters, they don't necessarily mean teens. In the salad days of TOS, the guys and gals were mostly in their thirties. That's almost four decades from where the big guys are now. I'm hoping for a flashy, unrestrained, color washed, muscle-flexing, space thrill ride with re-energized (pun intended) TOS characters.
Apparently your new or just haven't read this website much since the canceling of Enterprise. Rick Berman already tried that concept of "all new crew" etc. for most part he got a lot of negative feedback from people like us posting to this site and Paramount shot it down and Rick Berman is sidelined for now. So apparently this idea was the "terrible idea" I will go and see STIX because of this, so you are wrong. I wish you people stop talking and trying here undermine or speak for the majority that have already stated that this is what the want. I want this! and this is the way is supposed to be. If you reboot, change or morph ST from what has lead it to 40 years or the fact that it is the most successful TV franchise of all TV history. THAN IT IS NO LONGER STAR TREK anymore! Oh and by the way G4 has been showing the TOS episodes "Star Trek 2.0" for which you problably know, G4 for which I had read is getting good ratings off of it. How it that possible if ST needs to be rebooted or changed or whatever.
The needs of the one outweigh the needs of the many.
This gives Spock and Kirk the chance to come full circle.
Despite my sentimental favorite being TOS (with DS9 being my intellectual favorite), and my regard for Kirk and Spock , this is a terrible idea.
Nothing good is going to come out of this. Kirk was the Captain (no bloody 'Conference' Picard, wild Sisko, or 'Totally Unpredictable' Janeway can even touch him. Forget the other guys name, but he lost me with some gazelle speech early on).
Spock was the prototype science officer/Vulcan. Everyone else pales even though they are clearly modeleled after him. Data is just a blatant copy.
However, it is time for new blood, for godssake. The Necrotic Generation has nearly killed the movie franchise with their tepid -to be polite- offerings to the movie going public. The franchise needs a shakeup, not another look at two beloved and great characters. If they besmirch these characters that will just be a nail in the coffin of the franchise. With a new set of characters, they have much more creative freedom and no complaints from people with preconceived notions of the characters.
If JJ insists on going along this crazy path, the least he should do is introduce a completely fresh crew that can populate sequels. Atleast there's some hope and life for the franchise then.
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psp1
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For most people, even with the popularity of TNG, Star Trek IS Kirk, Spock, and McCoy.
It makes LOTS of sense that Paramount is heading in this direction and since it seems they are finally taking this franchise seriously, I'm one very exciting trekkie.
VoR
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Flavius: What do you call those?
Spock: I call them ears.
Flavius: Are you trying to be funny?
Spock: Never.
How can they be in it?
They have both aged and it shows, what time period can they show up in? In the 23rd century Kirk looks like Shatner did 12 years ago and he's dead in the 24th..
The only way I could picture it would be to have an event that occurs in the past that requires their presence in the future. Start the movie off in the 24th century with a hooded figure (Which is revealed to be Spock) retrieving Kirks body from a Federation 'morgue', resuscitating him with a mix of nanoprobes and a mind meld and then disappearing with him to the location of their first mission together at which point they flashback and we eventually find out why Spock has done this.
Shatners aged appearance can be explained by him being 'dead' 15 years ;)
Thats my fanboy idea anyway ;)
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My idea was like this:
Because there was a dead Romulan officer (or more) involved in "Generations", the Romulans went on to investigate, but under cloak, as usual (as they did in "The Chase", see The_Chase_(TNG_episode) in en:wikipedia.).
From some computer game's history section available on the web, the Romulans have had encounters with the Borg and they have destroyed some Borg ships, too. Or it was some other Trek-related fansite. It is conjecture, but very possible that like the Federation, the Romulans also have some of the Borg technology available to them, including the knowledge on how to resuscitate dead people, the way 7 of 9 did with Neelix (VOY, "Mortal Coil", en:wiki Mortal_Coil_%28Voyager_episode%29 ).
The Romulans observe the fight between Kirk, Soran and Picard, soon they see that Kirk is dead and after Picard and Starfleet has left Kirk's burying place and the planet, respectively, transport Kirk's body onboard, make an exact replica of Kirk's dead body, which they transport back (this could be done simultaneously by copying Kirk, but leaving his original body on the planet). Then they revive Kirk, but leave him alive and hidden in secret.
Might not be the Romulan Star Empire, but might be. In anyway, while Spock learns of this, he goes after Kirk and finds him (this could happen now). They could then together devise a plan to get Kirk out of Romulus, if it's still like the Star Empire we have come to know throughout the years.
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No reason Kirk can't have been revived SHORTLY after Generations, or Kirk isn't still alive in the nexus.
As has been pointed out by others...
Kirk goes into the nexus. Picard gets the snot kicked out of him by Soran. Picard enters the nexus as a result. Picard gets Kirk. Kirk saves the day, but dies. But now, Picard never entered the nexus. Meaning, Kirk was left alone, and would be there, never having met Picard.
Okay this is just the fanboy in me talking but consider the fact that William Shatner looks so much older than he did in Star Trek: Generations.
If this is done as a flashback, then the fans could reasonably speculate that Generations never really happened. After all, Kirk doesn't even look the same, right?
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The dog is a gentleman; I hope to go to his heaven, not man's. -Mark Twain
This idea might have been an OK way to get anti-reboot fans like me on board, except for the obvious fact that these guys are more than a decade older than we last saw them in their roles, and while you might make up Nimoy to acceptability, Shatner will need to lose half a cow to get even close to his former weight, and the darkest toupee in the world and the best Hollywood face lift artist arent gonna hide the other obvious ravages of time. This might do more harm than good.
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GET A LIFE, will you people? I mean, for crying out loud, it's just a TV show!.... You've turned an enjoyable little job, that I did as a lark for a few years, into a COLOSSAL WASTE OF TIME! -- William Shatner on Saturday Night Live (1986)
If you question the diea of having a younger Kirk/Spock, I direct your attention to the book Best Destiny. All they need to do is add Spock, move the story ahead about 10 years (in Kirk's life) and you've got it.
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"I’m worried about an opponent who uses nation-building and the military in the same sentence."
George W. Bush, 2000
Get busy living, or get busy dying.
Scott's Journal
Now, I'm offically excited.
RIGHT THE WRONG OF GENERATIONS!!!
KIRK LIVES!!!
with a 24th century Spock reflecting on his first meeting with Kirk in the 23rd century, and somehow that incident being remarkably connected to whatever is presently going in the 24th century. If they do it like they do in LOST, I suppose it could work.
Come to think of it, wasn't that Harve Bennet's original Academy idea? A flashback?
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"We're standing by to beam your survivors aboard our ship. Prepare to abandon your vessel."
"No – no, that is not our way. I regret that we meet in this way. You and I are of a kind. In a different reality, I could have called you friend."
"What purpose will it serve to die?"
"We are creatures of duty, captain. I have lived my life by it. Just... one more duty... to perform."
- Kirk and Romulan Commander
It's much too soon to tell, and I don't want to get my hopes up too much ... but indications so far point to the studio doing exactly what I've been wanting them to do - that is, recasting Kirk & Spock, without the dreaded "rebooting", and bringing Shatner and Nimoy onboard for cameos as the older versions of the characters. I just hope Paramount has more in mind in terms of their involvement than showing up to the premiere! What surprises me, and no one has commented on, is that Nimoy seems open to the possibility of contributing to the film, something he hasn't been willing to do in 15 years (remember, he flat out rejected a similar situation with Generations). That's good news.
But as I said, it is too early to get my hopes up. As much as I'd love to see a continuation of TOS, something about it doesn't feel quite right. I just can't see Paramount spending millions to recreate the look of a 1960's tv show and doing a totally retro feature. Still, the mere fact that Leonard says he has been contacted has raised my interest WAY up. STXI is fast becoming my most anticipated film of 2008, no small feat, considering what a Dark Knight fan I am. Incidentally, '08 will be the first time we've had Star Trek and Batman on the big screens at roughly the same time since 1989!
Now THAT'S more like it.
Star Trek is coming back. Halelujah!
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"Men don't use sex to get what they want. Sex IS what they want" - Frasier
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Forget it. If it's another prequel I, and I'm sure hundreds others, won't go see it. When will the powers at be realize that Trek needs to FORWARD, not BACKWARDS!
To me, if this is indeed what they're doing, then Trek is officially dead.
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Star Trek has always been about the characters created by GR. It never was the same in any form without it.
Berman LOST about 80 percent of the Trek audience with his garbage. Bringing back Kirk and Spock is the first step towards getting them back.
If the younger Kirk story takes place on the NCC-1701, then it really isn't a prequel. It's a continuation of the series.
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To me it was not just the characters, but the actors, writers and GR himself. There is no way to continue TOS because all of the components that made it what it was no longer exist - it was a product of specific people at a specific time that can't be recreated. JJ Abrams casting some dude and pretending he's Kirk doesn't make it TOS.
But if Shatner and Nimoy actually reprise their characters, I'm there even if I don't like the "young TOS" idea. The inclusion of Shatner on camera as a post-Generations Kirk is probably the only thing that could get me to buy a ticket for yet another Trek movie.
They don't even have to explain why Kirk is alive - they could not mention it at all (his presence would be proof that whatever needed to happen for him to live did indeed happen), they could make some joking reference to it that doesn't explain anything but establishes that something happened (something akin to Spock's "I've been dead before" lines), or they could explain it. I doubt they'd actually dedicate much story time to it, though - that would almost require its own movie.
Of course, I guess this article is more about Nimoy, and it's just Nimoy's speculation that involves Shatner...
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"Now the Senate is looking for moderate judges, mainstream judges. What in the world is a moderate interpretation of a constitutional text? Halfway between what it says and what we'd like it to say?" - Justice Scalia
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Quote from dx31701 to StillKirok:
There is no way to continue TOS because all of the components that made it what it was no longer exist - it was a product of specific people at a specific time that can't be recreated.
Gene Roddenberry et al were masterful in a classic and timeless writing style that has existed for centuries.
Alas, it's a style to which Rick Berman et al seem oblivious. Odds are, fans weaned on Berman Trek may be equally oblivious.
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EXCLUSIVE "Mirror, Mirror" Chekov Figure
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There was an intelligence in TOS that just didn't follow as much in the sequels. But I really do think they broke the mold with the characters. Kirk/Spock/McCoy have proven to be irreplaceable. Another crew just doesn't cut it--especially on the big screen.
It makes sense that they recast because at least then, they can WRITE for these characters.
But a recast is tough. Shatner and Nimoy doing a parallel story will do wonders for the franchise. Gives them a swan song. A real torch pass. And paves the way for a new TOS cast to continue in sequels.
The tactic isn't as effective if Kirk remains dead post-Generations.
Ok, first, I suppose I qualify as a fan boy.
Second, I think everyone on this post is overthinking the situation (in favor of drooling over the ideal). Paramount won't go to all the lengths you all are talking about. They have J.J., and to them, that's enough (so no extra dough for Riker, Worf, etc.).
Simply put, as Nimoy (from experience) believes, it will be a simple flashback with a "hey, don't you remember when..." motif to it. It doesn't HAVE to be anything more (to the studio), so it won't.
Sorry for the cold water, but this is my way of not getting my hopes up either. And experience in these things tells me to bring a bucket full of the ol' H2O.
Having said all that, I still do think the movie will be worth $9...and a couple of times at that. Hey, nothing like AMC popcorn, right?
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I don't care what "they" say..... "THERE...ARE....FOUR....LIGHTS!"
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A simple "remember when" would have been easy without Generations. But hell, if they're going to go for it and get Shatner and Nimoy, might as well go with the parallel story idea. Puts more fans in the seats and we can see the Kirk/Spock friendship one final time as portrayed by Shatner and Nimoy. Meanwhile, the torch can be passed on the parts to new actors. It would sell.
Ok, now that I'm thinking about this more. I assume they are going to recast Gary Mitchell and why Finnigan, two characters we KNOW were with Kirk at the academy and are established characters. And hey why not Carol Marcus. We can see Kirks first date! I'm kidding, but if your going to re-cast I would say forget the academy and finish the 5 year mission. I think it will cause to many continuity problems.
On a separte note, who out there would like to see a Captain Pike movie? Why does paramount avoid this man like the plague. It would be a hell of alot easier to recast characters that appeared ONCE (except for Spock).
it could be great to have them in the film!
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It's a rip-off. / We're stepped on, and cheated! / We're flat, stone-cold lied to / But we're not defeated / No!
Halen. "The Dream is Over."
This story is easy. Now that you have Shatner & Nimoy.
Follow me on this people. Captain Riker and First Officer Worf aboard the Titan are ordered to pick up Spock from wherever he's been for a threat that has it's roots in the past. Kirk is needed also so time travel is involved (USING THE GUARDIAN!!)but only back to Veridian 3 where Kirk is beamed out after he makes the missle visable but before he falls. There's a good 10 seconds to make that happen. Picard would not find a body and all we'd have is a mystery. Of course it's been 12 years so Shatner doesn't look the same but hey I'm not a pro. Weaved into this plot is the Kirk/Spock academy story. Which I'm VERY suspect of because any trekker worth a spit knows they were not in the academy together(HEY REMEMBER CHRIS PIKE) but if we can change actors nothing is sacred.
In this case I like the idea of a flashback.
Since we are approching the day when actors can have different faces and bodies onscreen - at a reasonable cost - with computer graphics, it makes sense to keep Nimoy and Shatner. Because they will live on as Spock and Kirk anyway. Any change will be seen as a blurp in history (and that is just more confusion).
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Well, as far as I remember from some story, post-production digitally "shaved" Jonathan Frakes' back hair off for the Riker/Troi love scene in "Nemesis", because he declined to have the hair removed in traditional ways.
So, Paramount wants some involvement of Leonard Nimoy in the next movie.
I think a story like this would be possible: Maybe something is threateing the Federation of the 24th Century. Spock has to find a way to stop it and/or bring back Kirk. To find a way to do this, he has to remember something that happened way back when he an Kirk met in the Academy...
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Yeah, I can't decide whether it's more awkward to claim that it's taking place in the 24th Century or just post-ST6. I mean...the actors are going to be noticeably older. Maybe it doesn't matter. Maybe Kirk had some anti-aging treatment during retirement, before Generations. Who knows.
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You're right. The actors ARE older. This can't be a prequel to Generations if they do it. Plus it would be SUCH a wasted opportunity. A parallel story where Spock plays the key role in bringing Kirk back in the 24th century, while recalling his first meeting with Kirk in the 23rd.
It would be amazing.
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