There are so many ways that Nero could have jacked with things during the years between the Kelvin and the main story in the movie. It would be interesting if at any point the Federation DID try to avoid historical mistakes and were to find out that Nero "beat them to the punch" in some way.
I'm not interested in a Khan story, necessarily (like others, I'd like less re-hash), BUT...if Nero decided to wake up Khan prematurely and give him a leg up on his future, that could be interesting. Nero might not have been that clever or diabolical (or might have simply wanted conquering hero-glory for himself), but the fact that there's a bunch of stuff un-told could have amazing consequences and theoretical tie-ins with this first movie.
I really hope JJ Abrams directs the sequel. It would be really nice to keep that continuity, kind of like the "Star Trek trilogy." (II, III, and IV)
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As a fan of all Trek iterations (and one that vaguely remembers TOS' original run), including 'your' Trek, whatever you do, please keep these things in mind:
1) Bring back the triumvirate of Kirk, Spock, and McCoy. I loved your Trek, but I realized that I also missed the 3-way interaction between the three. The interplay between Spock (calm, logical reasoning), McCoy (epitome of emotional human morals) and Kirk (man of action) remains, for me, one of the more compelling aspects of Trek. It is the ideal vehicle for exploring the Human Condition in extraordinary circumstances.
2) No villain, per se. An adversary, of sorts, fine, as they can provide some contrast that is needed for good storytelling. But instead, as others have suggested, present a challenge that is not based on an individual (e.g. not a villain). It can be a natural phenomenon, a consequence of previous actions, an ethical delemma, or even a fundamental philosophical difference (e.g. Federation vs. the Klingon Empire), whatever. Just not a singular villain that drives the plot, story, and action.
3) Look at the world today for your story ideas. Trek has always been about exploring humans in extraordinary situations, and it's done so within a contemporary context (while set in the future). We certainly are in a multitude of extraordinary situations these days... there's no reason why this approach wouldn't appeal to your new, or old, audience. You walked that line before... you can do it again.
4) Follow the same process you did for Star Trek. Don't let anyone interfere with it, and don't change it. Whatever you did, it worked. If it ain't broke, don't fix it. And DO NOT RUSH IT!!! Feel free to pass that on to JJ too.
5) Keep reading the boards, and stay in touch with the fans, new and old. The lack thereof in recent years is, IMHO, one of the things that nearly killed Trek.
Thanks for a great ride. I'm eagerly looking forward to the new one... but I can be patient.
LLaP
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THAT is the Exploration that awaits you: not mapping stars or studying nebulae, but charting the unknown possibilities of Existence.
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Don't let anyone interfere with it....keep reading the boards
Having gone through the last round, I think that, in the upcoming heat of things, this could become a contradiction. However, I think these guys have proven they know what to take and what to leave when it comes to reading the hyperbolic fan boards.
Great points, btw.
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I hear you, but I tend to disagree. As you said, there was a lot of *ahem* discussion amongst fans about each tidbit they leaked/released throughout the entire process leading up to the formal release of Star Trek. However, I don't think the pressure has changed: prior to its release, there was immense pressure from all sides (including the studio), since it was commonly believed that if this movie bombed, it would be a loooooong time before anyone tried it again. Now that the film is an unqualified success, the pressure's on to make it a quality follow-up.
*thinks a moment*
I wonder if anyone's posed that kind of a question to Bob & Alex, whether they feel more, less, or just different pressure for the next film as compared to what they felt while producing Star Trek.
LLaP
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THAT is the Exploration that awaits you: not mapping stars or studying nebulae, but charting the unknown possibilities of Existence.
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I wonder if anyone's posed that kind of a question to Bob & Alex, whether they feel more, less, or just different pressure for the next film as compared to what they felt while producing Star Trek.
If they are feeling any pressure it certaintly isn't from the notion they have to make the diehard fans happy anymore. Clearly, general audiences made up the bulk of the viewership of the new film so the writers have only to make THEM happy in the end. I am fine with that! I just don't think us web posters should think our ideas are being too seriously condsidered because in the end? It is their movie to write, not ours.. and most fans ideas are frankly not doable, too risky or just plain lame.
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-- Steve
"If a sixth Star Trek television series is ever realized, it will be set in the new universe." -- cdydatzigs, June 15, 2009.
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If they are feeling any pressure it certaintly isn't from the notion they have to make the diehard fans happy anymore.
Mmmm... I'm not sure about that... they've said many times that they read the boards, and that they're big fans. Since they were both prior to the film, then it stands to reason that they would remain so. Additionally, and this is far from scientific, but I imagine that the vast majority of existing fans really liked it, if not loved it. And let's not forget that the diehard fans consumed all things Trek for 40-odd years. Lastly, I imagine that most of the repeat sales are from existing fans.
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I just don't think us web posters should think our ideas are being too seriously condsidered because in the end? It is their movie to write, not ours.. and most fans ideas are frankly not doable, too risky or just plain lame.
I tend to agree, to a point. Story ideas submitted by the random fan prolly suck for the most part. But concepts, overall direction, and character plots/arcs/direction presented by fans I would imagine get a fair amount of attention by Bob & Alex.
LLaP
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THAT is the Exploration that awaits you: not mapping stars or studying nebulae, but charting the unknown possibilities of Existence.
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They may pay attention to what the fans are posting (which is great), I just don't think they in any way feel held hostage by us either. Star Trek fans aren't necessarily enough to make or break a box office because any smart Paramount employee knows that we are mostly just talk -- we'll go see any Star Trek film no matter what our opinion of it is going into it. [See: Star Trek: Nemesis] Hell, if the next film had Patrick Stewart standing on the bridge by himself and reading the ingredients off condiment bottles in his refrigerator for 109 minutes, half the people on this board would pay to see that!
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-- Steve
"If a sixth Star Trek television series is ever realized, it will be set in the new universe." -- cdydatzigs, June 15, 2009.
Well Bob and Alex,
If you happen to read this, then READ MY LIPS:
NO KAHN!!! Or any other fanboy wankerism!!
Please make it original. Don't revisit old stuff.
Make it exciting and thoughtful science fiction.
Dispense with the idea of ANOTHER villain PLEEEAASSEE!! Enough with the Kahn clones. Not that that is your fault of course, its just that for the last 7 movies we've had Kahn wannabe's.
Thank you for taking the time not to read this.
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Maybe Khan is actually a good antagonist and not just "fanboyism" as you delicately put it. It'd be like re-making The Bible except you leave out The Devil because "eh, it's been done".
Sheesh. I have NO idea why people are so adverse to using Khan. It blows my mind, really.
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An elephant never forgets . . .TO KILL!
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If you do read this, thank you. Now, no thoughtful scifi plot in the next film as some have suggested below - do what you did in the first film, great action/adventure with character interaction and development.
Build on the momentum you have with the general public. Save the thoughtful scifi plot for the third or the fourth film.
Using a fishing analogy, you have them hooked, now set the hook and reel them in.
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Build on the momentum you have with the general public. Save the thoughtful scifi plot for the third or the fourth film.
Or even hold off on the "thoughtful Trek" altogether. Yeah, us diehard fans eat that stuff up but the general audience wants a villian or conflict they can sink their teeth into. You don't want a Motion Picture scenario where it is all science fiction, no excitement and you lose that audience you just accquired in the previous film. Be smart, but keep the audience awake too.
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-- Steve
"If a sixth Star Trek television series is ever realized, it will be set in the new universe." -- cdydatzigs, June 15, 2009.
If a cerebral sci-fi exploration plot fails in Trek XII - they can always go back and do something action-y in Trek XIII - which will no doubt be greenlighted, and for which they already have the actors signed up. Might as well take a risk and do something that will get critical acclaim, even if not a box-office cleanout.
- Trek XII: Literary sci-fi
- Trek XIII: Klingon/Khan action
Could bring in some big name literary sci-fi authors to help come up with something. Maybe some social sci-fi that is largely planet-centric - maybe some 'into the unknown' exploration sci-fi with exotic alien worlds or space habitats. Then if it turns out bad, they can put Kang, Kor, Koloth and Khan in some fanwank epic lol.
The most important thing for an exploration plot though, would be to capture the enigma of exploration - this is essential. The feeling you get when reading a book on how an explorer stumbled upon an entire ancient civilization buried in a jungle - or the feeling an archeologist would get if they could go back in time and visit an ancient silk road trading centre, at the dawn of Buddhism. The cultures, if there are any, should be well concieved. The awe of Arthur C Clarke's Rendezvous with Rama, when stepping onto some alien space structure.
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Rushing to meet a deadline isn't a bad thing. Wrath of Khan was under the gun the entire production (Meyer slapped together a script from a few other previous drafts) and they got a great movie out of it. Everyone always says "taking your time" is for the best, but there's nothing wrong with sweating it out.
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An elephant never forgets . . .TO KILL!
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