Doesn't it say something that the 1,000,000,000th story about Shatner's return to S.T. has more hits than the conformation of Chris Pine as the young Kirk?
It Shatner comes back the ST community will go nuts.
For anyone who's guided by a headline, from a news outlet that gets quoted by Trek sites...
Contact Music reports, "Shatner To Appear in New Star Trek Movie."
Their uncredited source is WENN, which is dishing this story to the international news wires.
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Fantastic 4: Rise of the Silver Surfer -- Power Cosmic Edition
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The character is dead
...in the future (as pertains to this movie)...
Right.. he is dead in the "current" TNG timeline that Spock exists in, and niether of the two actors (especially Shatner) looks the same as they did pre-1994 before Kirk was killed off. I have ZERO problems with a voiceover, but on screen? Unless his part takes place in the plot-hole laden Nexxus? Then... oops, let's not get THAT one started now.
;)
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-- Steve
"If a sixth Star Trek television series is ever realized, it will be set in the new universe." -- cdydatzigs, June 15, 2009.
Give him the opening voice-over already!
Pine can do a monologue at the end of the movie...
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"I would be happy for Star Trek to come along decades later with a new group of minds. I'd love someone to say, 'Besides this one, Gene Roddenberry's was nothing!'" - Gene Roddenberry
"...I think it would be wonderful years from now to see Star Trek come back with an equally talented new cast playing Spock and Kirk and Bones and Scotty and all the rest, as they say tomorrow's things to tomorrow's generations..." - Gene Roddenberry
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You mean the opening monologue? That's a fantastic idea! Imagine the eruption of applause in the theater on opening night. Talk about automatic credibility as a Star Trek film. How they shoehorn him into the movie later, I have no idea.
He hasn't spoken it since '69, right?
If the story is true he can help recoup that $150 million like nobody else. Unless the part is a cameo or he's Kirk's Uncle or something generic. If that's all they want to do, I'd go with what they have.
I know that ACIN is usually bull, but I myself have always been highly suspicious of Shatner's very public "I'm not in it" whining, as well as JJ & crew's "were desperately trying to get him in there" stuff. The movie starts shooting in a few weeks!
It seems to me that he'll be in the film in a small way, 2-3 shooting days tops, and it will be a huge secret.
JJ & crew's statements are designed to prevent a out-and-out revolt among the "bring back Kirk" idiots, before fulfilling their 14-year wet dream, otherwise they wouldn't be mentioning it at all...
I for one don't think that there is any good storyline that will being back Kirk, but that doesn't mean they won't do it, and in the end, I will probably still enjoy the film. I might be wrong, but it just makes too much sense.
Right?
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So? I look at lots of atoms!
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The Noble Robot wrote:
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JJ & crew's statements are designed to prevent a out-and-out revolt among the "bring back Kirk" idiots, before fulfilling their 14-year wet dream, otherwise they wouldn't be mentioning it at all...
The only "idiot" is people like yourself that have been gobbling up forgettable Berman nonsense, giving us 20 years of mediocre CRAP. It's people like you as to why a reboot was needed in the first place.
But hey, keep calling people "idiots" from behind your keyboard, internet tough guy.
And you think "Generations" is a good movie, so you can step to the very back of the credibility line.
Get it? Got it? Good.
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Right. But how do they keep it a secret until the movie opens? It will be no secret. If a month before the movie Shatner is still protesting too much and Abrams has never definitively said he's not, then the gig's up. In fact, as you point out, they're about to start shooting and the script is surely written. If we are to take Abrams at his word, then they wouldn't merely tack him on. They've said that he must be meaningful to the story. So the gig's really up already, isn't it? The story's written.
Over the years, ideas have been thrown around on this board, and sometimes they would pop up in a movie or episode.
I'm hoping someone involved in creating Trek 11 saw and liked the idea of throwing Mirror Kirk in at the end as a cliffhanger.
They can't just resurrect Kirk for the movie. Nor can he play a younger version of himself (he just couldn't pass for a pre-Generations Kirk at his age). So, the logical choice would be Mirror Kirk.
The possibilities of future movie success would increase far beyond what they would be without Shatner, if he shows up at the end and is the villain for Trek 12.
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Respect the cannon
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Nor can he play a younger version of himself (he just couldn't pass for a pre-Generations Kirk at his age).
Sorry, but I really think this is argument is a nonstarter. Modern CGI tricks are more than capable of realistically making actors look younger than they really are.
So, the logical choice would be Mirror Kirk.
The possibilities of future movie success would increase far beyond what they would be without Shatner, if he shows up at the end and is the villain for Trek 12.
I do really like this idea, though. ; )
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"A billion robot lives are about to be extinguished! Oh, the Jedis are going to feel this one..."
-Hubert Farnsworth (Futurama: Crimes of the Hot)
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"The Andorian Mining Consortium runs from no one!"
-Shran (ENT: Proving Ground)
(spoilers)
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Spock discovers a plot to send TNG era Warbirds back to aid the Bird of Prey in destroying the Enterprise at Balance of Terror.
Spock, who is unable to communicate with Starfleet command and whose ship is underpowered to time travel backwards is forced to instead fly his ship into the Nexus.
There he meets with Kirk and convinces him to leave the Nexus to help save their earlier selves. As they ride their horses into the distance, Picard watches trying to figure out how he will defeat Soran on his own, since he isn't nearly as equipped for fistfighting as James T Kirk is.
Since they cannot defeat a Warbird with any TOS-era ships, they exit the Nexus during the Cardassian war and commandeer the Defiant, whose current commander, Worf, is only to happy to go kill some Romulans. This provides the a handy (and somewhat more believable than in Insurrection) method of awkwardly putting Michael Dorn into the movie, which appearantly now is in the Paramount constitution.
As the Defiant travels back in time and then across space to the Balance of Terror, old Kirk and Spock pick up transmissions from the TOS Enterprise, which is the only time we even see Quinto, Pine and crew in the movie.
The Defiant lays a mine on the hull of the Warbird, (since it's cloak is v.3.7 and the Warbird has only v.2.7-SP4, the Romulans never know the Defiant is within 3 meters. But before the Warbird is destroyed, Spock downloads details on a clone of Picard living with the Remans. As the situation near the neutral zone is resolved with Sarek dead amd Kirk/Spock alive, old Kirk and Spock determine that for some reason the entire TNG era is f'd beyond all recognition, almost like an evil creator had been screwing up everything since about Picards 3rd year in command of the Enterprise.
To resolve the sitution, Kirk and Spock convince Worf as well as Dax and Odo who are also on the Defiant that they have to clean up the mess of the 24th century, thus providing a plot for at least the next 4 movies.
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You know, it might work. Great work, Dukat!
If they don't get Dorn to act in the movie you may still see him in the credits.
"And not a special guest....Michael Dorn as "Mr. Wuff".
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"Life's tough. It's tougher if you're stupid."
-- John Wayne
"Space is disease and danger wrapped in darkness and silence."
--Dr. Leonard McCoy
"I'm a politician, which means I am a cheat and a liar, and when I am not kissing babies I am stealing their lollipops."
-- Jeffrey Pelt, The Hunt for Red October
"Liberals, Intellectuals, Peacemongers, IDIOTS!!!!"
- General Decker, Mars Attacks
"It's not safe out here. It's wondrous, with treasures to satiate desires, both subtle and gross. But it's not for the timid."
- Q from Q Who
Aint it Cool News has never been known for being the most reliable of sources -- especially when the headlines says and editor "claims" he's in it, followed by "Word to your mother."?
If William Shatner is "in" this film, I highly doubt it would be as the elder Kirk. The character is dead and he looks older and the actor has gained a lot of weight since 1994. VERY curious to see what happens with this.
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-- Steve
"If a sixth Star Trek television series is ever realized, it will be set in the new universe." -- cdydatzigs, June 15, 2009.
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The character is dead
...in the future (as pertains to this movie)...
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"A billion robot lives are about to be extinguished! Oh, the Jedis are going to feel this one..."
-Hubert Farnsworth (Futurama: Crimes of the Hot)
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"The Andorian Mining Consortium runs from no one!"
-Shran (ENT: Proving Ground)
Spock, upon saving the Universe with his younger crewmates one last time, does either one of two things before returning home:
- Encounters older Kirk in the alternate time line that has been created
OR
- Prevents Kirk's death in the 24th Century
Spock probably figures that the universe owes HIM one.
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"Encounters older Kirk in the alternate time line that has been created"
That is an idea I hadn't considered and would definitely work. Still, it would be a bit mystifying as to why Kirk is still alive in the 24th Century considering human's limited life expectancy. I suppose they could leave it a mystery, but it might distract from the rest of the plot.
Perhaps Spock could just visit his old friend on his way "Back to the Future".
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"What we leave behind is not as important as how we've lived."
~Picard
If it is true, and I am sure it is, you can all bow at my feet and swear eternal loyalty to Chaotic. I have told you all from the start I think it is PR stunt to keep TREK in news...
so...follow along with me when I say the following...
Somehow, someway, William Shatner will be in this movie. Not because of sentiment...but because of MONEY. It all revolves around money. And Paramount wans to make back that 180 million. Having Shatner has always, and will be, part of that equation...
Now...step back from my alter,and get back to your role's as minions...
Chaotic
Bringing order to the TREK world...
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Or, if it turns out to be the BS I predict it is, I will simply roll my eyes at Chaotic and move on.
I work in the entertaiment industry and there has been zero buzz about whether or not he's in the movie. No one cares.
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Sure there is...and was..
When the story first broke he wasn't going to be in it, it was a headline in the news. It was reported everywhere..E NETWORK..ENTERTAINMENT TONIGHT...DRUDGE REPORT even had it as THE headline of the day..I saw it on CNN and HANITY/COLMES when Alan Colmes asked the guest of the night, Drew Carey talking about Diabetes thing he works on, him about it...
So yes..his not being created buzz. In fact, just go to GOOGLE it and google all the articles about it..
So...not sure what you mean about buz, but the beeeeees were flying swarming when it hit...
Chaotic
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Hey Chaotic, I was bowing at your feet and I found some peanuts!
Thanks dude, you truly are a generous God!!!
Not to "pète ta balloune" (I really felt like using a Québec expression here...and I'm not tanslating, hahaha), but if it's the case, that's the kind of PR stunt a lot of us has been expecting. It means they care. No spolied script already on the web, like it happened with Nemesis.
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"Gods drunkenly cried juvenile acne, lop ears, the Lafontaine park, retirement at 60, disappointing love, public washrooms and raging toothaches"
tupperfan.blogspot.com
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Your importance in the great scheme of things is greatly over exaggerated. No sweat, though, I like to toot my own horn as well, and I have been in agreement with you on this since day 1. No doubt, Shatner will be Kirk again. "Second star to the right, and straight on till morning."
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"It's not who I am inside, but what I do that defines me." -Batman
www.gracelockport.com
Quote from Hercules:
"All publicity about Shatner not playing Old Kirk in the movie is lie."
So, the slow banana boat has just docked with the mainland. Welcome, Chiquitas!
Here in the land of skyscrapers, Team Abrams has declared their intent to include elder Kirk, and Shatner told us that JJ wants him in the story. There's time aplenty to tickle the script and ink a contract. Meanwhile, "I'm not signed up" Shat plays it perfectly straight. Gossipmongers kindled and stoked their own publicity "lie."
Coming down the creek: A dinghy of oblivious bloggers bellowing about campaigns of deception by a Bad Robot.
P.S. IESB.net says Karl Urban is confirmed for the role of Dr. "Bones" McCoy.
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Shrek -- The Third
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Meanwhile, "I'm not signed up" Shat plays it perfectly straight. Gossipmongers kindled and stoked their own publicity "lie."
Yay for reading comprehension! Yay for clever use of the spoken word! Yay for not jumping to conclusions based on purposely-cryptic verbiage!
Yay.
Now if they're really doing this, let's just hope that good taste prevails.
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"A billion robot lives are about to be extinguished! Oh, the Jedis are going to feel this one..."
-Hubert Farnsworth (Futurama: Crimes of the Hot)
----
"The Andorian Mining Consortium runs from no one!"
-Shran (ENT: Proving Ground)
Well, they have said that if they can find a way to work him into the script they will. They want to find a way to include him. He wants to be included. Most of the fans would like to see it. Since I, a lowly fan with no hollywood credentials can think of a million logical ways to include Shatner, I don't think it will be difficult for JJ and his team to do it.
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"It's not who I am inside, but what I do that defines me." -Batman
www.gracelockport.com
Quote:"Herc, in a brief post at AICN Readers Talkback message board, told everyone not to believe the hype about Shatner not being in movie.
How reliable is this guy anyways? I constantly hear people saying this site is unreliable.
Quote:""By the way." Herc wrote "All publicity about Shatner not playing Old Kirk in the movie is lie. Word to your mother."
I don't understand how this could be lie. Why lie? So far the media has not really picked up on this one so to have Shatner in the movie back at the con in San Diego with Leonard Nimoy would of been a major plus. It would of been the beginning of a major buzz among the Star Trek fans. I don't see how this lie was a publicity stunt.
Quote:"In another post, he replied to a skeptical user "I know a whole f#@*& lot about this movie that you do not. Wake up, Trekkie!!!!"
If he knows more about this movie then why didn't he say that Shatner was in the movie until now? Keeping a secret is obviously lost on him! haha
Quote:"AICN was the first site to post the story about the plotline of the movie involving Romulans and time travel, so we can presume the site seems to have inside sources regarding the Star Trek film.
Is he also confirming this First Contact storyline as well?
Quote:"This information is preliminary, of course, and entirely rumor.
I think it is just a rumor. Just last month you had Shatner in Las Vegas tell everyone he is not the movie.
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I don't understand how this could be lie. Why lie? So far the media has not really picked up on this one so to have Shatner in the movie back at the con in San Diego with Leonard Nimoy would of been a major plus... ...I don't see how this lie was a publicity stunt.
Perhaps if you stop taking the word "lie" so literally in this whole situation...
Or perhaps you should familiarize yourself the concept of a wink and a nudge.
It would of been the beginning of a major buzz among the Star Trek fans.
You see, if they'd announced it back then, then they would have already "blown their load." By waiting, they've been letting the Shatner-buzz simmer for a while before bringing it closer to a boil by letting little things like this slip. Hype does have a shelf life, and there are people in Hollywood that get paid exorbitant salaries to time stuff like this "just right."
Of course, this might all still be some dude's wet dream, but the point is, Patti, that jumping to conclusions when the people disceminating the information are obviously being coy is a silly endeavor. We [u]know[eu] nothing yet besides the principal cast and Nimoy's inclusion.
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"A billion robot lives are about to be extinguished! Oh, the Jedis are going to feel this one..."
-Hubert Farnsworth (Futurama: Crimes of the Hot)
----
"The Andorian Mining Consortium runs from no one!"
-Shran (ENT: Proving Ground)
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Maybe it is meant as the big surprise which they either want to reserve for the last announcement regarding the movie (maybe they will show him in the trailer) or they want to surprise the audience when they watch the movie for the first time.
It was clear that when a new Star Trek movie is announced and Nimoy is in it that everyone would ask Shatner if he would be in it, too. He could not say "Yes" if it is meant as a surprise and he could not says "Let's wait and see" because it would have been the same as saying "Yes". So he said "No, I am not in the movie" to keep it a secret.
At least I hope it is so. Having Shatner and Nimoy together in the movie would be incredibly cool.
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or they want to surprise the audience when they watch the movie for the first time.
That's been my prediction for months now. And even if we never hear a forthright confirmation of Shatner's inclusion, until a member of Abrams' team makes an announcement that flat-out says: "William Shatner is not in this movie," I think that will continue to be my prediction.
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"A billion robot lives are about to be extinguished! Oh, the Jedis are going to feel this one..."
-Hubert Farnsworth (Futurama: Crimes of the Hot)
----
"The Andorian Mining Consortium runs from no one!"
-Shran (ENT: Proving Ground)
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Except that they can't play coy right up until the movie starts. At some point it will be obvious he either is or isn't going to be there because "we" will keep asking them the question and at some point it will be too late. "I know the movie opens tomorrow, but we are still trying to find a way to fit Shatner in the movie." In fact, it's really too late now, because they've written the bulk of the story. So ironically, if he's going to be a secret, then they'll have no CHOICE but to say something flat-out like, "Nope. He's not in it. Couldn't find a way."
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Quote from c.p.
In fact, it's really too late now, because they've written the bulk of the story.
Your conclusion presumes that elder Kirk participates in the bulk of the story.
Nimoy has used the term "bookend."
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Ratatouille
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I didn't explain myself very well. Like you guys, my conclusion now is that Shatner is in this movie for the reasons you and others have given. But one of my conclusions is that keeping Shatner's presence a secret till the release won't work--not just because the cat will escape the bag--but because plausible denial will become increasingly less plausible, and at some point impossible, as opportunities to add or change the film diminish. I also concluded, perhaps prematurely, that it has diminished to that point already, because the script is written and filming begins soon. THAT conclusion rests on what Abrams and team have said thus far on the subject of Shatner. I'm sure you have the actual quotes at hand, but I believe they said they wouldn't put him in the movie unless his presence is meaningful to the story. I took that to mean integral. I'm not sure how you'd accomplish that "integrality" in a story that's already written. That seems more like a clumsy tack-on a la the Generations death scene. Not to waffle, but I wouldn't say it's impossible in the right hands. So I might have to move the “for sure” deadline back a little.
I hadn't read the "bookend" comment from Nimoy either. Where is that quote?
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Quote from c.p.
But one of my conclusions is that keeping Shatner's presence a secret till the release won't work
Team Abrams hasn't kept Shatner's presence a secret.
Abrams' very first public statement about casting was a commitment to include Shatner -- in a way that's "worthy" of the movie, the fans, and the actor. That commitment was reiterated just last week, by co-writer Roberto Orci. Can you claim to know better about their script and schedule?
The only secret is story detail.
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Spider-Man 3 -- Two-Disc Special Edition
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Quote:
Can you claim to know better about their script and schedule?
I was commenting on the idea that he can be kept a surprise to someone who thinks he will be. We seem to agree that it's no surprise, though my reasoning is different than yours. I don't recall the headline, "Shatner is Cast in Abram's New Star Trek Movie", yet and I think that's because it's never been said definitively. I've been persuaded he's in it anyway partly because of the ambiguity of statements on both sides, and partly because it seems late in the script process to still not have a definitive answer on a "worthy" part for a lightning rod character, though I conceded it's still possible.
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Quote from c.p.:
I don't recall the headline, "Shatner is Cast in Abram's New Star Trek Movie"
Some blogger bylines might bitch, "Shatner Joins Backward Film. Oh Dear."
Last November, Shat spoke of his powwow with JJ: "He wants me to be in the movie."
What are the odds of a no-show, when an experienced team sets their own objective?
Abrams' project isn't rocket science. The goal isn't world peace. It's a sci-fi story, in which anything can happen.
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"Amok Time" -- Spock
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I think they planned to have Shatner in the movie right from the beginning. He would have the same meaningful part as Spock. Let's assume the plot rumours are true. Spock and Kirk travel back in time to help their younger selfs. Their only problem would have been to explain why Kirk is alive again. It is a problem they can deal with, maybe they already have dealt with it. I can't imagine Nimoy having a major part in the movie and Shatner (if he is in it) only appearing briefly. I believe their parts will be equal.
As for keeping it a secret until the movie opens. Yes it will be difficult, but they managed it with Star Trek 3 and Spock/Nimoy. They can manage it again.
...will he zap Daddy?
No, no no...yes.
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Growing up leads to growing old and then to dying,
And dying to me dont sound like all that much fun...
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Political tags-such as royalist, communist, democrat, populist, fascist, liberal, conservative, and so forth-are never basic criteria.
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Samuel T. Cogley, Attorney at Law
will do to the story is show that even in the 23rd century, botox still looks horrible on men.
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"I once asked Axl why he left off the "e" in his name. He started crying and said he thought he spelled it right." -Slash
This is the best ST news ever. I am thrilled.
Haha!!! Gotta love the internets!!!
I actually do find myself kinda hoping this is true, if only because it'll just be too cruel on all of you Shatner devotees if the rumor winds up being false...
If the screenwriters and JJ can find a way to put Shatner in in a way that doesn't detract from the story, I'm all for welcoming Shatner back one last time.
If they can't find a way to make it work, I'd rather nobody tried to force the issue, though.
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Shatner casts a large shadow over this movie. Too many people want him in yet they seem to be ignoring it.
Nimoy is on record as saying the movie would be better with Shatner in it.
As for Herc, the big question is--
why make the statement solely in a talkback, instead of a main article?
In short, I won't believe it until I see it.
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