Sunday March 6th 2-3pm EST 2005 at the Anderson Public Library in the Delaware Room [third floor] Anderson Indiana will be a presentation of The Fun Frontier of Star Trek. The U.S.S. Endeavour, a local Star Trek fan club, and special guest Deborah Downey will discuss how to have fun while promoting the Star Trek philosophy. Deborah Downey was one of the space hippies in the episode " The Way To Eden." Learn about collecting, costuming and the " Save Enterprise" movement. I , Gary Barclay, will be there to show a video of Scotty, James Doohan, receiving his star on the Hollywood Walk Of Fame. I attened the Beam Me Up Scotty farewell tribute and convention in L.A. California that was held Aug. 28-30th 2004 next to Hollywood and Highland at the Renaissance Hotel. I was the person wearing the Star Trek uniform from the original series who danced at the Friday night cocktail party with the woman with the bright blue hair and the Star Trek The Next Generation uniform. I will be displaying pictures of me with the entire surviving cast of the original Star Trek series along with individuals with Scotty "James Doohan" Capain Kirk "William Shatner" and Spock " Leonard Nimoy." I will also have some other cool stuff on display. I will be looking forward to seeing you there. Live Long And Prosper! \\// ,
Where the hell was this man four years ago??
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It would be to the damage of humanity if people are over censored. It is like the Red Scare of the 1950's and McCarthyism. - AdzlW
i totally agree 'but it's spelt Red Square' - Klingonharder
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Where the hell was this man four years ago??
He was prepping his Odyssey 5 for broadcast on Showtime. ;-)
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"I think the show talked to people through the characters. They're stories that speak to the heart. They talk about love, they talk about friendship, they talk about loyalty, they talk about patriotism, exploration, curiosity, reaching out... And I think all those things still touch people. Even when you look at a 30-year old show, it still has something to say." - D.C. Fontana, Sci Fi Channel Special Edition TOS 1998
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"If the season finale involves the re-built USS Reliant coming back in time to the 21st Century crewed by Moogie, Dr. Selar, Morn, Transporter Chief Kyle, and the Salt Vampire, then we'll know that Coto has gone too far." - tomba1701
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Eh, who knows. At least, he's here now.
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"We're standing by to beam your survivors aboard our ship. Prepare to abandon your vessel."
"No – no, that is not our way. I regret that we meet in this way. You and I are of a kind. In a different reality, I could have called you friend."
"What purpose will it serve to die?"
"We are creatures of duty, captain. I have lived my life by it. Just... one more duty... to perform."
- Kirk and Romulan Commander
It is just a shame that Manny was not around in the beginning. It would have been interesting to see how he would have functioned around Generations, Deep Space Nine, or even Voyager. Hell it would been even more interesting to see what he could have done with the Generation Movies. It seems that he trully understands the direction needed to make star trek fly straight. Hopefully someone at the network and the studio will take the time and read between the lines and make a choice to end the cancellation and give Manny the chance to prove himself.
I agree with Manny, then again, I'm biased. ST needs more marketing and promotion. They fixed the quality issue in season 3 and 4. Now, they need to promote it. I was happy with the aggressive promotion for the Augment arc, and sadden that little promotion was given for the Vulcan arc, and hardly none for the Romulan arc. I'm sorry, but if you are really trying to revitalize demand for your product, you increase the quality and then you shout as loud as you can "come back in, we've fixed it, we've fixed it!"
I want to see this show on Sci-fi, I think it would have potential there. UPN has abandoned the Sci-fi market, but Sci-Fi channel loves sci-fi stuff. Again, I know I'm biased, I'm fan hating that a show I like is getting cancelled. But, if they're making money this season, why not throw dice on marketing and see what happens? What do you lose, for one year you have a low ROI. Fine, but in the long-term its important to test the waters on marketability and profitability given a full-fledged marketing effort for a high-quality trek product.
I'm afraid that the next time UPN and paramout has the balls to try their luck on marketinga new Trek product, they wont have the usual maturation time to get the product where it should be in terms of quality. Remember how every TREK show revamped near season 3, and finally found its stride in season 3. Well, if the next Trek franchise falls by the same percentage rate as every successive Trek show, it wont last for longer than one season. Learn from the mistake of cancelling DS9 and VOY too early, you have a trek product that has finally found its stride, and its voice. Roll the dice on this baby and see what happens. Again, the only thing you have to lose is a one-time marketing fee for a year. Its better to risk it on a high-quality product than a potentially mid-quality or low-quality product.
That's just my opinion, biased and all . . . then again . . .
So, I hate to spoil it but I've heard from a couple places (and I believe it) that the final episode will be with Riker and Troi telling their child about the founding of the federation and Archer's role in it. It'll be a series of flash backs showing all the history they wont be able to cover in later series.
Not sure why I posted it on this thread, but there it is... :)
Is anyone else smelling bittter denial? Those sound like some killer idea, though, too bad we'll never see them. ;_;
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Many thanks to Jean-Luc for my siggie!
Now that it's over, I don't really want it to go. Well, if it was as dismal as the first 3 seasons I would help pull the trigger, for the Franchise's sake. But now they've finally gotten their act together and I would hate to see the series go out this way.
I'm torn as to what to hope for. In one way I want it to be saved with overwhelming fan support. But on the other hand, I think it was the misguided belief that the fans will watch anything and love it regardless of the time, talent, and money invested, that lead us to this.
I think Star Trek needs a break. If I ever thought that Paramount would invest in a series—or THREE series all at the same time—with writing talent and special effects, and guest stars, and advertising, then I would be all for it. But unlike TPTB behind CSI, I'm not convinced Star Trek has all that anymore. I'd rather let it lie until someone(s) with a passion for it resurrects it properly. Perhaps Coto’s the guy, but if so, he needs to convince Paramount that they need to reinvest in Star Trek in a big way, if they want it to be viable anymore.
Amen Brother Coto. Really what is lacking for Star Trek is 3 fold;
Writing
A Decient Network (or suplemental syndication)
Advertising (To pervert the works of Mel Brooks: "Advertising, Advertising, Advertising.")
I also think that the next series should be more fan driven, have open submissions like DS9 and VOY had, have more non-western european ancestrial humans, and Be set near the end of the 24th century... like the mid 2390s that way we can have some thing interesting happen in 2400 and 2401, and bring up the old arguement of when does the next century really begin.
TEG
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The Tegian Zone • Grow My MiniCity
....to see the show ending when I have just gotten attached to it. I agree with Coto in part. Enterprise should NOT end. The series may have to, but not Enterprise. I think it would be great to see it continue in limited form- TV miniseries. Could it really kill the studio to make three or four TV movies a year?
After DS9 ended, every season of Star Trek since then has felt empty until now. I faithfully watched Voyager's last two years(and that show was still terrible) and Enterprise, waiting for it to get good while jaded Trekkers said it was pointless to do so. FINALLY, Manny Coto took over, hired some great new writers(the Reeves-Stevens) and turned Enterprise around and made it into a respectable Trek series worthy of its predecessors. I'm so disappointed and definitely sad that it's ending now.
Ironically, during the awful "Storm Front" two-parter(or the first three seasons for that matter), I never would have imagined myself saying that about ENT's cancellation. I was one of the people who would have been welcoming its cancellation in open arms if that drivel had been the precedent for this season but I was pleasantly surprised.
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I don't for a moment believe STAR TREK needs a break.
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If people can watch 47 versions of CSI, we can have more than one version of STAR TREK.
As I've been saying, and been criticized for it, Star Trek doesn't need a break if a series is done well. It's nice to see the executive producer of Enterprise agrees.
It's a shame Berman's working on a Star Trek XI script, though. I think, with all the fan support this season, Coto's made him look bad and I doubt Coto's going to be around much after the series ends. That hogwash that Berman & Braga were still working behind the scenes, as they said, is yet another load of crap they were trying to shovel to us to save some face. Braga was off getting "Threshold" together and Berman was off trying to get Star Trek XI going. Other than looking over scripts I doubt they really had much to do with this season. Look at the episodes to see evidence of that. Once Enterprise ends though, I'm sure Coto, the Reeves-Stevens's and others are out the door. And Berman's going to focus on Star Trek XI, which will be a tremoundous box office bomb. A disaster of epic proportions.
Star Trek needs a change in the "new ship new crew" format. A different version of life in the future. A broader type of canvas to work with. I don't really know what, because I'm not paid the big bucks to come up with series outlines, but something big that will make people sit up and take notice. An idea bigger than anything Berman will be able to come up with, I can tell you that.
I hate reading between the lines of statements made by insiders but it really does appear that Coto has the right attitude towards Trek and that other insiders seem to not have a good attitude. Ratings are what make the show go around and direct competition with other facets of the genre can't be much help. Just hope that somehow this Trek chapter does not end now.
The genuineness and the warmth to this responses...this is a guy who really loves his work and wants to put the best damn show together.
Compare this to a Brannon Braga or Rick Berman interview and you see a dramatic contrast.
I hate Berman.
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"We're standing by to beam your survivors aboard our ship. Prepare to abandon your vessel."
"No – no, that is not our way. I regret that we meet in this way. You and I are of a kind. In a different reality, I could have called you friend."
"What purpose will it serve to die?"
"We are creatures of duty, captain. I have lived my life by it. Just... one more duty... to perform."
- Kirk and Romulan Commander
What is unfortunate is Berman's sentiments were never Coto's sentiments. Coto reminds us that it's a team effort -- he speaks of the cast and crew's involvement and the appreciation of the fans and how such things as the ad in the LA TIMES matter. Berman's statements never equalled the emotion and drive and passionate-support of the franchise as Coto's.
Berman never made that connection with the fans -- and perhaps his personality simply doesn't 'gel' with people. His statements on the cancellation, I think, reflected what he thought Paramount wanted to hear -- not what he really felt -- like Coto.
Berman's a businessman and ST is a business venture -- and he knows that in LA: you're as good as your last movie/show -- and he knows his value as a producer has fallen because the value of the franchise has been reduced.
It will be interesting to find out if he loses his office on the Paramount Lot after ENT is off the air. If he does -- a sure sign he's gone from the franchise. It's also interesting to note that none of the scribes are Coto or a member or members of his writing staff. A talented group like that -- and you don't ask one of them to be part of Trek XI?
Paramount may have given Rick Berman some seed money for a spec script of Trek XI - and Berman may have leaked the story about Trek XI to VARIETY to generate interest for the project -- that he could associate himself with -- to keep his name out there.
Without a project in the pipeline, without a value to one's talent to produce revenue -- who's going to invest $50 million for your movie?
Sometimes...people in a job 'run the course' of what they could do for a company or project. Michael Eisner has for Disney but he's been forced out; Rick Berman kept the franchise in production for 18-years but it's apparent the time has come to leave -- and he should move on to some other project that is not ST.
Coto's a class act with a great future and perhaps one day he'll part of the franchise again -- or perhaps he'll pen a ST ENT novel or two. Whatever he does -- he'll have the support of a grateful fandom.
I get tired, really tired, of seeing Berman act the way he does, and then we see someone like Manny come to bat for the fans. What's more, unlike the glory whore duet that is B&B, Manny is quick to point out that it's not all his work (but I suspect it does have lots to do with his guidance).
I really hope people turn out for this LA protest/event, and I hope it has an effect on Paramoun and/or UPN to give Enterprise a chance (and further, to actually promote and fund the show like they want it to succeed)-- I'd really like to see Manny get his chance to explore the season five ideas he discussed.
As much as I wish this show would continue I really cant beleve anything is going to change. There is always hope with insiders like Coto wanting to continue it but it seems the writeing is on the wall.
Hey maybe the network announced it was cancelling the show early to get the fan reaction. It is free promotion for the show and if ther decide to change their minds it will be pretty big news hence more free promotion.
As much as I wish this show would continue I really cant beleve anything is going to change. There is always hope with insiders like Coto wanting to continue it but it seems the writeing is on the wall.
Hey maybe the network announced it was cancelling the show early to get the fan reaction. It is free promotion for the show and if ther decide to change their minds it will be pretty big news hence more free promotion.
I really love that mans attitude. I hope he will be involved with the next Star Trek series. He has a lot of surprisingly good ideas. Ideas that already helped ENT, and helps to prevent oversaturation.
I look forward to hearing something official about the next Star Trek series. The audience is most likely willing and waiting, well for the most part. But I also think its good to wait a little, maybe a year. Creativity needs time. Time brings creativity.
So whoever will be producing the next series, I have no problem with seeing Coto in the team!
Is coto the right man for trek?
I don't know for sure, but I do know this, at the very beginning he gave credit to EVERYONE on the staff, how often has Berman done that?
That shows to me that Coto's head isn't inflated to the size of a hot-air balloon like Berman's seems to be.
But there is also logic in a plan by B&B to put Coto out there to satisfy at least some of the fan base, while they slink around in the background, and if push comes to shove they can blame it on Coto.
Yes, ratings haven't been great this year, but that's hardly coto's fault. THe move to fridays, but more than that the end years of Voyager, and up til now haven't been that good. I don't care how good Coto is, you can't fix something like that over night, or even in one season.
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If people can watch 47 versions of CSI
His use of the number 47 made me laugh out loud!
Manny is THE MAN to lead Star Trek. Here's hoping that he'll get the chance to do so.................
LLaP
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THAT is the Exploration that awaits you: not mapping stars or studying nebulae, but charting the unknown possibilities of Existence.
Manny Coto is part of B&B's new window-dressing. He hasn't done anything that doesn't conform to a B&B mandate to wank TOS "fetishists", and Berman recently expressed amusement at ENT fans who believe that he and Braga aren't still large and in charge in the creative department. S4 has lost viewership, from S3, courtesy of weak and uneven storytelling.
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Star Trek vets surmise the franchise
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Weak and uneven storytelling?
You're an idiot.
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"Worlds may change, galaxies may disintegrate, but a woman always remains a woman."
--James Kirk, "The Conscience of the King"
"Vulcan children are never late with their sehlats' dinner."
--T'Pol, "The Forge"
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I disagree. I don't think that B&B are capable anymore of some of the creative stories that have been shown in S4.
Also, I have long ago completely disregarded anything that comes out of B&B's mouths. They have shown themselves to be arrogant and disrespectful of the hands that feed them, and on countless occasions they have mislead fans to believe one thing when the facts proved something else.
They just don't want to admit that Coto has done a far better job than they have.
LLaP
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THAT is the Exploration that awaits you: not mapping stars or studying nebulae, but charting the unknown possibilities of Existence.
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Quote from NX-47:
I don't think that B&B are capable anymore of some of the creative stories that have been shown in S4.
It's for lack of creative storytelling that S4 has bled audience.
The Coto/Brazeal chat transcript is revealing, if not entertaining. The mutual ring-kissing by these birds of a feather is hot and heavy. I've seen Tim Brazeal actively misrepresent facts on message boards, to con fools who have more money than brains; now Manny Coto says, "I think the younger fans of today could be the Star Trek writers and the Tim Brazeals of tomorrow."
ENT seems cursed, in life and in death, by those who claim to be its caregivers. Berman, Braga, and Coto contributed to disgrace ENT during its production, and Tim Brazeal (a.k.a. TrekUnited) is hellbent on making a mockery of STAR TREK with ENT's demise.
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Star Trek vets surmise the franchise
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I find it hard to look at this season and not see significant improvement. I know, to each his own, but still....
I also wonder where/how you put Coto in the same boat as B&B. Unless he's a flat-out liar (which is always possible with anybody), I tend to look at him as sincere in his love and dedication to Star Trek. However, as long as B&B are able to call any shots, any effort by anybody to make any substantive creative and strategic changes will be hobbled by B&B.
LLaP
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THAT is the Exploration that awaits you: not mapping stars or studying nebulae, but charting the unknown possibilities of Existence.
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Quote from NX-47:
I find it hard to look at this season and not see significant improvement.
It may be said that there's been "improvement" in S4, considering the depths of ENT's dreck, but the "improvement" is on such a superficial level that it hasn't impressed viewers who demand sensible storytelling.
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I also wonder where/how you put Coto in the same boat as B&B. Unless he's a flat-out liar (which is always possible with anybody), I tend to look at him as sincere in his love and dedication to Star Trek.
I too believe that Coto's lifelong enjoyment of STAR TREK is real. That doesn't make him a competent writer, or someone who won't sing for his master.
At the end of S3, B&B must've realized that their TOS name-dropping scheme for S4 would be flatly rejected if it appeared to come from them, so they installed a willing and well-paid frontman and scapegoat. No coincidence that Coto went from talking like a Mini-Me Berman in S3 to suddenly being Mister "I am every Trek fan" shortly before Dawn Ostroff announced that S4 would be stunt-driven. Coto is a puppet on a string, like any other B&B plot-driven character.
Using Coto in an "Operation Scapegoat" for S4 was a win-win scenario for B&B. If ENT had succeeded with Coto (seemingly) in charge, making B&B look bad, the Executive Producers would've cried all the way to the bank. As it is, Coto has played the martyr, and B&B can say that their being "hands-off" didn't save the series, and thus blame their failure on franchise fatigue.
B&B are incompetent at making STAR TREK, but they were brilliant at working ENT's fans this season.
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Star Trek vets surmise the franchise
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Quote from NX-47:
I find it hard to look at this season and not see significant improvement.
It may be said that there's been "improvement" in S4, considering the depths of ENT's dreck, but the "improvement" is on such a superficial level that it hasn't impressed viewers who demand sensible storytelling.
I take it you are speaking for all of us on this subject? Personally I think he has done a better job in bringing back Star Trek to its roots than B&B ever did. Had Manny been around for DS9, there is a chance that the show would have maybe lasted longer than 7 seasons.
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I also wonder where/how you put Coto in the same boat as B&B. Unless he's a flat-out liar (which is always possible with anybody), I tend to look at him as sincere in his love and dedication to Star Trek.
I too believe that Coto's lifelong enjoyment of STAR TREK is real. That doesn't make him a competent writer, or someone who won't sing for his master.
Please name me one show on television or at the movies that has a competent writer out there in Hollywood please.
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At the end of S3, B&B must've realized that their TOS name-dropping scheme for S4 would be flatly rejected if it appeared to come from them, so they installed a willing and well-paid frontman and scapegoat. No coincidence that Coto went from talking like a Mini-Me Berman in S3 to suddenly being Mister "I am every Trek fan" shortly before Dawn Ostroff announced that S4 would be stunt-driven. Coto is a puppet on a string, like any other B&B plot-driven character.
Using Coto in an "Operation Scapegoat" for S4 was a win-win scenario for B&B. If ENT had succeeded with Coto (seemingly) in charge, making B&B look bad, the Executive Producers would've cried all the way to the bank. As it is, Coto has played the martyr, and B&B can say that their being "hands-off" didn't save the series, and thus blame their failure on franchise fatigue.
All I can say about this is "Let's blame Coto" for the problems created by B&B. Blaming Coto is like blaming the Bashers for the show cancelling, or blaming music and video games for the problems of society.
B&B are incompetent at making STAR TREK, but they were brilliant at working ENT's fans this season.
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Star Trek vets surmise the franchise
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Quote from Whitewulf :
Blaming Coto is like blaming the Bashers for the show cancelling, or blaming music and video games for the problems of society.
I don't "blame" Coto any more than I blame Scott Bakula or anyone else who sings in Berman's daffy "We're All Very Pleased" choir to stay on the ENT payroll.
TV producers and entertainers, like most people, do whatever they feel is necessary and appropriate to support their lifestyle. Connor Trinneer, for example, stars as "Mr. Wonderful" in Japanese Tobacco commercials that'll entice idol-worshipping children into the deadly habit of cigarette smoking. As "nice" a guy as Trinneer may be, he must see nothing wrong in his contribution toward horrible illness and death; and he isn't the first, only, or last person whose base desires put a price on conscience.
Compared to that, being a B&B puppet to make piss-poor sci-fi doesn't earn "blame". Ridicule, yes.
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Star Trek vets surmise the franchise
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I take it you are speaking for all of us on this subject? Personally I think he has done a better job in bringing back Star Trek to its roots than B&B ever did. Had Manny been around for DS9, there is a chance that the show would have maybe lasted longer than 7 seasons.
Ok, Coto being good guy or bad guy arguments aside, don't invoke DS9 in this argument. DS9 (especially in its latter seasons) was perfectly fine the way it was, and didn't/doesn't need screwing with by anyone, including Coto. The show ended when it was supposed to, the way it was supposed to (aside from perhaps a little mish-mosh in "What You Leave Behind" and that kind of annoying Dukat/Winn arc.). I think if ANYONE had tried to drag the show out any longer it might have become the victim of some of that "franchise fatigue" everyone's talking about.
Besides, the current "8th Season" novel relaunch is fantastic, and couldn't have been pulled off nearly as effectively in television format.
And there-in lies Star Trek's future (at least for the moment)... novels. You want more DS9, pick up a book. I'm sure there will also eventually be an ENT re-launch series that will deal with the formation of the Federation and such. On that note, I say to all desperate Star Trek fans: read the books! They're good, honest.
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Lily: You mean those bionic zombies you were talking about? The...
Picard: Borg
Lily: Borg... sounds Swedish ~Star Trek: First Contact
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And there-in lies Star Trek's future (at least for the moment)... novels. You want more DS9, pick up a book. I'm sure there will also eventually be an ENT re-launch series that will deal with the formation of the Federation and such. On that note, I say to all desperate Star Trek fans: read the books! They're good, honest.
Unfortunately, in the rush to destroy the franchise everywhere it exists, the Trek novel portion of the franchise is about to take a hit.
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"I think the show talked to people through the characters. They're stories that speak to the heart. They talk about love, they talk about friendship, they talk about loyalty, they talk about patriotism, exploration, curiosity, reaching out... And I think all those things still touch people. Even when you look at a 30-year old show, it still has something to say." - D.C. Fontana, Sci Fi Channel Special Edition TOS 1998
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"If the season finale involves the re-built USS Reliant coming back in time to the 21st Century crewed by Moogie, Dr. Selar, Morn, Transporter Chief Kyle, and the Salt Vampire, then we'll know that Coto has gone too far." - tomba1701
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wll then... all I have to say to that is... FUCK! Please excuse the harsh language, but that isn't the half of what I'd say if this weren't a respectable forum lol. Great, now they're killing it for those of us who can read too...
Thanks for the info btw Jadzia, irritating as it may be.
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Lily: You mean those bionic zombies you were talking about? The...
Picard: Borg
Lily: Borg... sounds Swedish ~Star Trek: First Contact
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Yeah, it's really a shame. I was just telling one of my co-worker Trek buddies about this yesterday and we were both laughing about how we both had a box filled with books still to read, but that eventually, they would get read and now there is the scale back.
IMHO, I agree that stuff shouldn't be churned out just because they can do so. But I think the fact that many in the fandom often become attached to a "favorite" series among the 5 - particularly the newer ones beyond TNG (TNG certainly having had many many books released - I know I have the first 30 or so before having had the opportunity to pick up the first DS9 ones when they finally started coming out during the show's run), that each of these later series should be allowed the opportunity to grow through books as much as TOS and TNG.
Ah well...
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"I think the show talked to people through the characters. They're stories that speak to the heart. They talk about love, they talk about friendship, they talk about loyalty, they talk about patriotism, exploration, curiosity, reaching out... And I think all those things still touch people. Even when you look at a 30-year old show, it still has something to say." - D.C. Fontana, Sci Fi Channel Special Edition TOS 1998
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"If the season finale involves the re-built USS Reliant coming back in time to the 21st Century crewed by Moogie, Dr. Selar, Morn, Transporter Chief Kyle, and the Salt Vampire, then we'll know that Coto has gone too far." - tomba1701
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As for Coto as a scapegoat, I think it's more likely that B&B (or at least Berman) knew "the writing was on the wall" (to borrow from the vernacular of interviews here) and decided to start looking more into doing other things.
They gambled that Coto could change things. And if he succeeded, they'd take credit for having the vision to push him to the front. If he'd failed, well, the ratings were already in cancellation range, so it's not like Coto'd look anymore culpable than B&B (who drove them that low already). B&B could then say "franchise fatigue"/"not out fault" OR put the blame on Manny, as you seem to be doing here.
This appeal he has to the hardcore also boosts the chances of people springing for this season on DVD.
The reality is that even aside from "continuity porn" the actual writing has been much better this season; it's actually competent. Now Manny doesn't deserve all the credit there (I tip my hat to the Reeves-Stevens' as well, and others), but for the first time in years this feels like the quality of writing seen in TOS, TNG, and DS9 (on their good days), and which was virtually non-existent in VOY or ENT s1-3.
I think Trek is victim of the "Boy Who Cried Wolf" phenomenon. The series have been losing viewers since TNG's end at an almost inevitably bottoming out rate. During VOY especially, it was almost a mathematical function. I projected the ratings would be low enough to be cancelled in the 3rd or 4th season in Season 1. Guess I was right. But the ratings could never hit zero, they could simply only ever reach the absolute hardcore that will never, ever, give up on a Trek series no matter what. But after years of hearing those people say "Dude, I know those eps of VOY/ENT sucked, but I'm tellin' ya, last week was GREAT, this show's really picking up!" there's no capacity left to draw viewers back in. They've been burned too badly for too long. And damn few people are going to come into a show they've been out of for even half a season, let alone a whole season (or 3 seasons). Once ratings got to the level they were at in Season 3, the show was essentially doomed.
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"If Tyranny and Oppression come to this land, it will be in the guise of fighting a foreign enemy."
-James Madison
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It may be said that there's been "improvement" in S4, considering the depths of ENT's dreck, but the "improvement" is on such a superficial level that it hasn't impressed viewers who demand sensible storytelling.
Careful... your wording is starting to remind me of Ro. ;-)
Again, this probably boils down to a difference of opinion. However, I have found myself 'feeling that old Trek feeling' more times this season than I have for the preceeding seasons and for most of VOY.
I, and many others, feel that ENT is finally *starting* to live up to the true Star Trek legacy... and now, they cancel it. IT WAS JUST GETTING GOOD, DAMMIT!!!
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That doesn't make him a competent writer, or someone who won't sing for his master.
No, it doesn't... he may simply be really good at sucking up. But, I do feel that he is a competent writer. I thought "Affliction" was a top-notch ep, and it was penned by Coto. Given the overall dangerous goal of the ep (ridgeless Klingons), I think Coto handled it masterfully; since the new ridgeless Klingons are essentially Klingon Augments, that potentially means that those that Kirk & Co faced were more deadly than any others. To me, that demonstrates Coto's respect for TOS, continuity, a longstanding Star Trek race, and the Star Trek universe as a whole.
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Using Coto in an "Operation Scapegoat" for S4 was a win-win scenario for B&B. If ENT had succeeded under Coto, making B&B look bad, the Executive Producers would've cried all the way to the bank. As it is, Coto has played the martyr, and B&B can say that their being "hands-off" didn't save the series, and thus blame their failure on franchise fatigue.
No arguement here. I just happen to believe that Coto has been hobbled by B&B this year.
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As it is, Coto has played the martyr, and B&B can say that their being "hands-off" didn't save the series, and thus blame their failure on franchise fatigue.
'Franchise fatigue' MY ASS. (Sorry for that brief outburst). You know as well as I do that the concept of 'franchise fatigue' is a crock. It's an EXCUSE for their ineptitude. If Star Trek episodes (be they TOS, TNG, DS9, VOY, or ENT) consistently engage, entertain, and excite viewers, people will watch, and lots of them.
Creative poeple are born every minute... there is no shortage of cretivity in the Star Trek universe- except where it currently matters most: at the helm of Star Trek production (Coto & Co excluded). Paramount/Viacom would do well to show B&B the door, and hand off stewardship of Star Trek (and ENT) to Coto, the Reeves-Stevenses, and other fresh, excited and creative minds. Paramount/Viacom might be surprised to see Star Trek return to it's former popularity (and profitability).
LLaP
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THAT is the Exploration that awaits you: not mapping stars or studying nebulae, but charting the unknown possibilities of Existence.
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"Careful... your wording is starting to remind me of Ro."
Incredible. I post one thread in a forum I visit perhaps once every three months, and now I'm the ENT-gushers posterboy for negativity.
Geez, you people have a persecution complex.
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The autumn days swung soft around me, like cotton on
my skin. But as the embers of the summer lost their
breath and disappeared, my heart went cold, and
only hollow rhythms resounded from within.
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Quote from NX-47:
Again, this probably boils down to a difference of opinion.
Of course this all boils down to difference of opinion. And the opinions that matter to Paramount are those held by the vast majority of STAR TREK's many millions of fans who don't want to watch ENT.
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Star Trek vets surmise the franchise
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So, are you against a Coto-ran, B&B-less Enterprise?
Just curious, as the likelihood of B&B NOT being involved in Star Trek in the near future is low....
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THAT is the Exploration that awaits you: not mapping stars or studying nebulae, but charting the unknown possibilities of Existence.
Manny Coto is so right. Imagine how great it would be to have Star Trek night... If they can do it with that crappy Stargate why not Star Trek, which can kick any other sci-fi show's ass..
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"In every revolution, there's one man with a vision"
-- James T. Kirk
i dont post here often, but i had to reply to this. this is the man that should be running star trek from now on. hes willing to fight for the show over kissing paramounts ass. did u hear those story ideas ppl? season 5 would be incredable. sounds like the cast and crew are all pulling for the trek community to get there voice heard. hes right about csi too. we need to finish up three more seasons of ent and then move to cotos 25th century trek.
i love lamp
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