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Do you think it's because it's a bad show? Of course not. Even if ENTERPRISE is not your cup of tea, it's not a bad show. It's a quality show.
*Yawn*
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-j
Someone actually managed to get BANNED from TrekWeb!? I can't even remember the last time a post got deleted, let alone an entire poster.
-Xaliphor
When I watch Enterprise, I never feel like I'm keeping up on what's going on in the Star Trek universe. Enterprise is "all in the past" and doesn't hold the interest for me. For me, the ST uiverse is now post-Nemesis. Whatever happens in Enterprise will have absolutely NOTHING to do with the universe of Star Trek.
Voyager also had this problem, for me. I felt like whatever they did wouldn't have any influence on the ST universe. When I realized they may find their way home, it got more interesting because the events would then become part of the canon of ST beyond losing a ship in the Delta quadrant.
With Enterprise taking place so far 'in the past' leaves little for me to be interested in.
Is Enterprise picking up any new ST fans?
TNG, DS9, and Voyager just seemed larger than life to me and I continue to read the books (those in the TNG timeline). Enterprise is like blip on the radar screen. Perhaps it's interesting for a quick peek, but the worls it lives in just seems so small and too similar to our world right now with terrorism and war.
Things could have been done so differently with Enterprise to make it more interesting but I think the premise is flawed anyhow.
If they wanted to start a new franchise, they should follow Riker as captain of the Titan or something in the current timeline of Star Trek, or even be bold and go farther in the future (but it would have made the movies based on TNG less interesting).
If the movies truly are finished with the TNG timeline, it's time to get bold and daring.
Someone mentioned doing New Frontiers tv-movies. That would be very interesting. This could also give them the ability to hand over the reins to a new producer to experiment with the look and feel of Star Trek, particularly one who knows nothing about Star Trek.
Star Trek fiction is much more compelling than Enterprise, unfortunately, but thankfully so!
Cymro said:
There's that, plus the fact that DS9, VOY and ENT alienated a big chunk of the audience by being developed on a different premise to what Star Trek was originally about. Even though Voyager is called TNG-lite, it lost those things that made it recognisably Star Trek. It wasn't on the enterprise, it was no longer about exploration, and rather than use the humanity themed formula of TNG and TOS, went with "random space adventure" stories, which rarely produced anything good. Same problem with Enterprise before B&B tried turning it into another DS9.
DS9..quality show with character development and a long story arc...TOS and TNG didn't focus on these things, and ultimately, DS9 lost viewership because space wars are boring compared to stories about omnipitent beings consumed by guilt for destroying an entire species, or two people who hate eachother because their skin is black on differet sides.
I completely agree!!
The answer is:
Too many shows have an almost identical theme to previous ENT episodes, previous TNG/VOY/DS9/TOS episodes.
For god's sake do something DIFFERENT! What happened to the "new" tech revealed? We got phasers in the pilot and some weak-assed force fields.
Season three opened with the sudden appearance of photon torpedoes after Malcolm marveled at such a thing on that stranded Klingon ship (apparently completely unaware of what they were, yet they were quickly developed?).
Here's an idea very briefly touched on in Season One:
Show EARTH! What are the people of Earth thinking of Enterprise's mission, what happens on Earth during the missions? Is there a media like in ST:Generations? Is the program getting its funding cut/expanded based on the realities of space exploration (hey they are shooting at us! we need PHASE CANNONS!)?
What about the families/relationships with people on Earth? All of the people on the ship up and left for many YEARS? How about Archer facing the parents of the people who died under his command.
The last thing this show needs is green slave girls or awestruck underlings marveling at a ship traveling faster than Warp 5 or force fields while getting kidnapped every other episode by hot female aliens or male aliens with varying amounts of bumps on their foreheads.
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I have always thought that the Enterprise should return to Earth at least once a season. This is, after all, the first deep space mission for Earth. It is far too early for "five year missions", and the Enterprise cannot possibly be too far away.
The Earth episodes could be for R & R (like Raisa), or refeuling or refitting with new technologies. This could give Reed a break from inventing phase cannons, photon torpedoes, red alert, etc. Since this is supposedly the very early days of Star Fleet, we should see what is developing at home.
just not coming up with solid ideas most of the time. The stories are hitting the mark.
Enterpirse may have been a mistake, but it's here, so they should work withit and turn it over toe fresh blood/ideas, etc.
The big mistake was Paramount not opting for some TV movies, plus a new Frontier series or mini-series; Peter David's stuff works - well, captuing the spirit of both TOS and TNG plus DS9 as well.
I watched every episode of the first two seasons, and there was not a single one - NOT A SINGLE ONE - that I thought was enjoyable or worthy of star trek standards. The writing was piss-poor and the story ideas were, at best, lame and uninteresting. Even worse, the show did absolutely nothing to advance or contribute to the star trek mythology - at most, it completely fucked it up (wasn't the first contact with Klingons supposed to be some sort of huge misunderstanding, grounded in the complex differences between the two cultures, that kicked off a decades-long war? This stupid show relegated that into Archer and the enterprise doing one unambiguously nice thing for the Klingons after another, and the highly-stereotyped Klingons snarling and being bitchy in response. What a fucking waste. They had a chance to show how one of the most interesting conflicts in Star Trek history unfolded, and instead they made it into the most moronic, dumbed-down, cartoon-like interaction imaginable. The people who did DS9's Dominion War could have done this right. But not the people who thought the only real problem with Voyager half-way through the show's run was that the actresses' breast sizes were too small...)
People haven't jumped ship from this series because they are tired of the Star Trek brand name - they fled in terror because the first two seasons absolutely sucked (even made Voyager look good in comparison). People didn't want their good feelings about the franchise ruined by the continuing shit-a-tude that was this most recent series (they left because precisely because they were so fond of the brand, not because they were tired of it). The only reason I kept watching, (despite the fact that after every single episode in the first two seasons, I would wonder aloud, "Why the fuck am I watching this awful show?"), is that I was holding on to the unlikely hope that the show would turn around, and start being something more of the quality of TNG or DS9 (pretty much the reason I kept watching Voyager too...). The third season, surprisingly, wasn't half bad - not up to Trek glory of the best of TNG or DS9, but definitely some enjoyable, interesting episodes came out this season (mostly written by the fresh blood that was finally brought on board, like Manny Cotto) - but I can hardly blame the people who left the show earlier for losing faith...
Stop, please, just stop.
JMS submited a plan for a new series to Paramount a couple months ago.
My plea is that Paramount actually LISTEN to what he has to say. Only someone like JMS, someone who is an intelligent writer and knows what he's doing (he wrote the best sci-fi series ever, Babylon 5, one of the most, in my opinion, intelligently written sci-fi series ever), can save Trek now.
Quote:
Braga says he values the show's loyal audience and wonders whether a TREK series could ever regain the type of popularity seen at the height of TNG.
WOW!!! This statement says it ALL!!! First of all, he may value ENT's loyal audience as most of them don't understand the issues that the STAR TREK franchise's loyal audience tends to take issue with, such as the quality of the teleplays and the continuity/canon stuff. He has made disparaging comments in the past that directly insult people who feel that the show isn't aiming very high. And secondly, he wonders if a TREK series could ever regain the popularity seen at the height of TNG, this tells me that he has no idea where to go with ENT, that he doesn't have much faith in ENT (regardless of the stupid opening theme song), Braga is basically done, whatever achievements he has attained in the past, he's an abject failure as far as ENTERPRISE is concerned. Now he's not stepping back as previously reported, I suspect that it was a publicity stunt engineered to create some internet buzz, it seems as though TREK relies very heavily on this kind of tactic, so sad.
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"Beam me up Scotty, there's no intelligent life down here."
In defense of Brannon against all the vitriol that I just get tired of, you know, DEEP SPACE NINE was my favorite show and by all accounts a critical success creatively. But no one is going to lie and say it was a TNG-like ratings success. DS9 was down to like 6-7 million viewers by the end, and yet it was the best STAR TREK ever produced. And yet even with that quality, it couldn't get the ratings of TNG. So there is definitely some truth to the fact that the geneal audience is generally tired of STAR TREK. If it were all about quality, why didn't DS9 have TNG-like numbers?
I'm also going to defend ENT. It IS a quality show. Perhaps it's not the best STAR TREK show we've ever seen and I admit that the first two years were lackluster. But even so, and especially with the effort to go a new way in season three, ENT is far and above many shows on television. I think fans forget that because they get so caught up in this world where they hate Brannon no matter what he says.
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It's a rip-off. / We're stepped on, and cheated! / We're flat, stone-cold lied to / But we're not defeated / No!
Halen. "The Dream is Over."
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Quote:
I'm also going to defend ENT. It IS a quality show.
Something I was always afraid to say because I knew my head would be stuck on a pike if I did LOL. Not that I mind, but it would serve no real purpose other than the cheap thrill of being yelled at by nerds.
Like I said about Stargate:Atlantis; seeing that show and so many other shows on TV that just make me sleepy, I realize that ENT really is a quality show. A show that is flawed but certainly not the trash heap that so many uber nerds claim it to be.
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Quality how? Because it has dime-a-dozen production values? Hell, if you are talking about sets, costumes and special FX -- yes, the show is on a par or maybe a notch above most shows. But the writing is HORRIBLE and so is the character development. Plus, the producers and writing staff don't have a CLUE as to an overall goal/plan for this series. It's all a bunch of experimental knee-jerk reactions based upon what they perceive can boost the ratings.
Where is the creative integrity and where is the cutting-edge writing?
THOSE are the things that make a quality science fiction series -- and those things are amiss on Enterprise.
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Quack!!!
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So if you don't like Enterprise you're a nerd now?
You and the people who stay home to watch Enterprise on Friday nights must be the only normal people with lives in the whole world, right?
:-)
Back on subject though, for me to honestly say that I believe Enterprise is not a quality show I would have to watch many more episodes than I have. But much of what I've seen shows me that it is not a quality show. "Similitude" or "Shuttlepod One" are "quality" episodes, but with things like "Chosen Realm" and "Countdown" I have a hard time believing that Enterprise is a quality show.
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So if you don't like Enterprise you're a nerd now?
Now now, no need to be defensive. As I was speaking of the elite class, the uber nerd, the Poindextrous pocketprtoectrous.
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I have a hard time believing that Enterprise is a quality show.
Well dear, that's entirely up to you.
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Quote:
I have a hard time believing that Enterprise is a quality show.
Quote:
Well dear, that's entirely up to you.
Whoopee! I am now the ultimate authority on what TV shows are good or bad!
Oh wait, that's not what you meant...damn...
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There's that, plus the fact that DS9, VOY and ENT alienated a big chunk of the audience by being developed on a different premise to what Star Trek was originally about. Even though Voyager is called TNG-lite, it lost those things that made it recognisably Star Trek. It wasn't on the enterprise, it was no longer about exploration, and rather than use the humanity themed formula of TNG and TOS, went with "random space adventure" stories, which rarely produced anything good. Same problem with Enterprise before B&B tried turning it into another DS9.
DS9..quality show with character development and a long story arc...TOS and TNG didn't focus on these things, and ultimately, DS9 lost viewership because space wars are boring compared to stories about omnipitent beings consumed by guilt for destroying an entire species, or two people who hate eachother because their skin is black on differet sides.
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Dig deep piles of rubble and ruins
Towering overhead both far and wide
There's unknown tools for World War III
Einstein said 'We'll use rocks on the other side'
No survivors!
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Quote:
I think fans forget that because they get so caught up in this world where they hate Brannon no matter what he says.
Wrong. What you call "vitriol" is frustration because the guy won't go get another job and quit ruining Star Trek! We don't like what he's doing with Star Trek. Put aside your brownosing aspirations (we know you have some kind of ties to Braga) for just a second and you might be able to see Trek the way we see it.
Even more, you might be able to see what our beef is with Braga...he needs to go.
Paramount should put JMS in charge!
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Quack!!!
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Quote from Rhett Quacklah to Steve Krutzler:
Put aside your brownosing aspirations (we know you have some kind of ties to Braga) for just a second and you might be able to see Trek the way we see it.
Considering the content of Steve's post, and the uncommonly wide freedom in expression of opinion that Steve allows to prosper on this privately owned forum, your personal contempt steps over the line into eye-for-tooth insult.
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NX-01 Model Kit
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No, dumbasses...he's friends with Braga. Ask him and he will tell you so.
And yes, Steve is a big brownoser whose friendship with Braga colors his view of modern Trek.
And that's no lie!
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Quack!!!
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Quote:
I think fans forget that because they get so caught up in this world where they hate Brannon no matter what he says.
Wrong. What you call "vitriol" is frustration because the guy won't go get another job and quit ruining Star Trek! We don't like what he's doing with Star Trek. Put aside your brownosing aspirations (we know you have some kind of ties to Braga) for just a second and you might be able to see Trek the way we see it.
Even more, you might be able to see what our beef is with Braga...he needs to go.
Paramount should put JMS in charge!
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Quack!!!
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Quote:
I think fans forget that because they get so caught up in this world where they hate Brannon no matter what he says.
Wrong. We don't like what he's doing with Star Trek. Put aside your brownosing aspirations (we know you have some kind of ties to Braga) for just a second and you might be able to see Trek the way we see it.
Even more, you might be able to see what our beef is with Braga...he needs to go.
Paramount should put JMS in charge!
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Quack!!!
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is that they're going to make a prequel film after that statement about people being tired of Trek. Was that determined to be untrue? I haven't heard anything else to the contrary. And does the 'tired of Trek' theory hold water if 5yearmission.com has had 6 million downloads of it's first episode?
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"Outer Space: The Last Frontier.
These are the trips of the Star Trek Enterprise. Its five year plan calls for us to explore strange new worlds, to seek out new life and new civilizations, to boldly fly where no man has gone in space. Live long, and be happy."
Patrick Stewart--SNL, Stardate 9402.05
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You are so right. ENT is only one of 4 shows that I do watch on TV. And thats because I find everything else to be crap, though admittedly, I havent sat down and given every show a fair chance due largely to time constraints. But a lot of shows that I do watch hen I have free time are dumb. They only get the ratings they do because of the advertising---which ENT lacks.
I will also say that Brannon is full of shit because he knows damn well that he and his partner are partly to blame. Your writing is less than perfect (It sucks). But, come on, do you really expect either of them to say it? Would you if you were them? Do you really expect GWB to say that he fucked up in Iraq rather than point the finger at someone else? Will Kobe Bryant ever realize that he can't play ball as well as he thinks? So many unanswered questions.
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Everyone has the right to have their own opinion, and I've got mine too. It seems very much in harmony with B&B and surely, with a lot of other people. I will not attack the opponents, however. Think whatever you want.
So how many drugs is Brannon Braga actually on, anyway? Yikes, that guy couldn't be more clueless if he was Frank Drebin from Police Squad! (The Naked Gun movies, for the uninitiated).
Seriously, though, unlike the majority of the anti-Berman/Braga regime, who seem to revel in hatred of anything with their names attached to it, I've enjoyed much of the last season of Enterprise, because, to my mind, there was evidence that the Powers that Be knew there was a problem. They saw that fans were getting VERY bored and disgruntled, and came up with what they thought would be a sure-fire solution: a season-long plot full of action, drama, and even a touch of romance. Well, for some, it was what the doctor ordered. For others, not so much, and yet others were so pissed off by that time that pretty much nothing would put out the fires of their rage. For me, it had its ups and downs, but I won't go into that now, since this rant of mine is gonna run long enough anyway.
To be honest, I'm not even sure what to think about Berman and Braga anymore. One moment, you think they know exactly what they're doing to the Star Trek franchise, because despite all the ranting and raving we, the fans, do, they'll sometimes openly defy us and do whatever the hell they think is best for Star Trek. "They don't like the theme song? TOO BAD, SCREW 'EM, IT STAYS!" "Fan sentiment for T'Pol is down? They say she's being exploited for T&A scenes? SCREW 'EM! Order that tighter outfit for Jolene's scenes next week!" The next moment, they'll seem to baffle everyone with a cluelessness so shocking it takes your breath away, such as Braga's interview. How can he honestly believe the garbage coming from his mouth? I think he's suffering from O.J.-itis: the condition in which even though you're guilty as sin, you've convinced yourself that you are innocent of the crime.
As for his comments on maintaining interest in Star Trek, until now, I've never been so tempted to fly to L.A., march into Paramount Studios, storm into the Star Trek production offices, and slap Brannon Braga upside the head. The Star Trek books sell in great numbers every month, the two Star Trek: Elite Force PC games were among the biggest PC game sellers ever, and there are conventions held anywhere you can think of, just about every weekend of the year with fans from all over the world attending! For pete's sake, they made 2 movies...TWO!...documenting Star Trek fandom around the world, and how significant a force it still is! People still watch the previous four live-action series on cable or syndicated stations, and the DVDs are selling like hotcakes (and just you wait for when TOS shows up in stores!). How can Brannon Braga claim to know ANYTHING about the audience he's working for saying something like that? No! What he should be saying is "Interest is tough to maintain when we aren't bringing the fans the quality stories and characterization that they've come to expect from Star Trek. We've gotten too lazy, relying on shock value, special effects magic, and bizarre plot twists, hoping to keep our audience, and it's not working out that way. This upcoming season is our last chance to fix things, or it's all over for Enterprise."
God help Trek fandom this upcoming season. Just hunker down and pray for daylight...
It will be difficult to maintain interest when a franchise has been on air non-stop for 17 years.
As much as I've generally liked Enterprise, I still don't understand why they even greenlighted a fifth series after the reaction and ratings for Voyager.
i wonder if it's because paramount's lawyers are sending dmca nastygrams to the ISPs of those using bittorrent to download the weekly episodes to watch enterprise.
i guess paramount's official message to enterprise fans is "if you can't watch it on tv when it's broadcast, then we don't want you watching it at all".
ok, paramount, i got the message. i'll watch Stargate Atlantis instead...
It's amazing what happens to a franchise when it stops being about something and just jacks off the cash cow week after week. Of course people are going to lose interest ...
There are so many gifted writers out there with such better ideas. It's a crying shame none of them are running the show ...
--AB
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Stupid is as stupid does. :)
Come and get it! Chum for one and all! dig in boys and girls!
Oh Brannon, thank you, thank you, thank you!!!!!
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Quote:
Do you think it's because it's a bad show? Of course not.
Of course not! I mean seriously, guys, that would be so totally ridiculous.
Hah! Who actually thinks that a bad show would have bad ratings? Just because they both have the word "bad"? Yes, you simple minded Star Trek fans might think that, but trust me on this one, it's a preposterous notion. There's no other word for it. Purely preposterous.
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There he goes again.
As one of those "simple-minded" Star Trek fans I freely admit that I love Enterprise and watch it every chance I get. Does that make me "simple-minded" I guess it does. Fortunately, I haven't reached that low intelligence cursor and taken to posting sad little diatribes on a message board about how bad a fictional TV show is ... :-)
Just because I'm "simple-minded" I'll restate that I like Enterprise more than TOS!
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"I was told this ship was the pride of Starfleet. I find it is small, and unimpressive."
"Funny, I was about to say the same thing about you."
Archer and Gral spar verbally in: "Babel One."
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Quote:
There he goes again.
Yep. :-D
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As one of those "simple-minded" Star Trek fans I freely admit that I love Enterprise and watch it every chance I get. Does that make me "simple-minded" I guess it does.
I did not call you "simple-minded." It was a joke, and not even a joke aimed at you or any ENT fan. Reread what I wrote.
Quote:
Fortunately, I haven't reached that low intelligence cursor and taken to posting sad little diatribes on a message board about how bad a fictional TV show is ... :-)
Well I suppose I could start criticizing Fox News or something...
This man just doesn't get it. I would guess that there are not many fans that are more loyal than Trek fans. To lose not only the peripherally interested viewers but that solid core is just catastrophic, and yet Braga blames the franchise itself. HEY, BB, you RUN the franchise! I can't believe that he is this self-deluded. ENTERPRISE is a quality show in certain aspects, with great effects and sets, but the stories are uninspired drek.
Oh, and by the way, I used to watch TNG weekly on satellite, way back in 1987. Really.
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"Let's make sure history never forgets the name Enterprise."
Jean-Luc Picard, Yesterday's Enterprise
I've lurked these boards for ages but this is the first time I remember that I've actually felt the need to post on something.
This is the biggest load of deluded horse crap I've ever heard. Braga needs to go. Now. I've never been one to make such rash statements, but this tears it. When you blame the franchise itself rather than what you've done with the franchise... well, geez.
The idea that Trek is played out is ridiculous. The universe is huge and the number of fan ideas for new series and films is a testament to that. There are an infinite number of stories to tell; the only problem is they aren't telling the stories the majority of people want to hear.
Trek isn't played out, Braga is played out. This isn't a huge slam on him; anyone who does the same thing over and over for years without a break is bound to get tapped out eventually. But when you delude yourself that the fault lies elsewhere than yourself you become a prize chump.
Trek needs new creative blood. Not someone who's going to chase off most of the viewing public and insist that everything's OK. The spin coming out of Paramount for the new season is really disgusting in its tone-deafness concerning any of the aspects that make Trek stand out from any other cookie-cutter sci-fi.
So, basically, Braga can get bent. I would have sympathy for his situation but he's proven himself totally deserving of reproach with these statements. I can only hope that Paramount will pull their heads out of their orifices, look at the cold hard numbers, and finally decide to step in and shake things up in Trek management.
Michael
Quote:"Brannon Braga speaks in the current issue of Dreamwatch magazine about the show's dwindling ratings over the course of its three-year run."
See!! For those who say ratings don't mean anything it is clear that they do! Whether quality means ratings or not is debatable. However it is pretty obvious that if something is really good it gets ratings.
Quote:"It's an enormously complicated issue," Braga told journalist Ian Spelling.
Shows starts out with 16 million and now you went as low as 3 million. What is so complicated? The show lost the "long term core" Trek audience which are known to be incredibly loyal. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to figure this out. The shows sucks!
Again we see all the finger pointing to everyone else except them! HOW bloody arrogrant!
Quote:""There can be no doubt we've lost viewers, as have all the networks in general.
What other networks are crying about a lost of viewers? What is he talking about? UPN sucks. I don't hear NBC, ABC or CBS whining about this. This is just spin by Braga in an attempt to try and make something out of nothing.
Quote:"You've got to put it in the context of ratings in general if you're going to compare the numbers for ENTERPRISE to the numbers for THE NEXT GENERATION, which is what most people do, without putting it in context. Very few people had cable and there was no satellite TV. Things are different now."
What a load of BULLSHIT!!! That has NOTHING to do with anything. It makes NO difference if people back then didn't have satellite TV or cable. They still had 20 million a week. Most networks are on BASIC cable/satellite packages. HOW can a show like the Sopranos get 20 million a week then? If people like the show they will find a way to watch it. Everyone now a days has cable etc. There are 500 channels on Direct TV and do you think that UPN or ENT is not a show that has 500 channels????? Let me say this again 500 CHANNELS!! What does this moron think is playing on those 500 channels? This is just an excuse!
The loyal core Star Trek audience is gone! Pissed off by crappy Trek by Berman and Braga. It is that simple!
I would like to ask Brannon how it feels tobe the cause of losing such a loyal core audience of 20 years in the course of 5 years?
Quote:"Braga admits, however, that ENTERPRISE has lost a significant amount of viewers since its early episodes.
You can't put a spin or make up an excuse about cable for the last 3 years. You can't hide from the numbers.
Quote:""Having said that, we have lost a lot of our audience since ENTERPRISE premiered, and you can't deny that," he says.
This the only honest thing this jackass as said.
Quote:""Do you think it's because it's a bad show?
You had 20 million for TNG. You had 16 million for the pilot. You have on average 3.5 million. The loyal core audience is gone. Well I would say "YES YOU DIPSHIT!"
Quote:"Of course not. Even if ENTERPRISE is not your cup of tea, it's not a bad show. It's a quality show.
In the world of medicine we call this "Denial".
Quote:"I think the fall in ratings is just because people have had enough of STAR TREK.
Who's fault was that? You inability to keep Trek fresh is the reason. Just resign you incompetent jackass!
Quote:"Even when we do an episode like Twilight, it's still the 700th episode of STAR TREK."
So what? A reset button episode. BIG DEAL. An episode mind you that he did NOT write.
Quote:"Braga says he values the show's loyal audience and wonders whether a TREK series could ever regain the type of popularity seen at the height of TNG.
Nope.
Quote:"All we can do is do the best job we can and value the four million people who are still watching ENTERPRISE loyally every week,
It is really 3.5 million. What is this "best job we can" stuff? He didn't write hardly anything this season. So he is just talking through his ass. He wouldn't even spit on any of the beloved "4 million people that watch" if they were on fire.
Quote:"which is nothing to sneeze at. It's not the glory days, but how could it be after so many years of continuous STAR TREK?"
Gee how could the 21 James Bond film be the HIGHEST grossing film of the series after 35+ years? This 3.5 million a week is an embarrassment to the legacy of Trek. Just because something has been around for a long time doesn't mean the ratings or popularity of it are suppose to dip. There are far too many examples to counteract this comment. It is just pure LAZINESS on his part and ARROGANCE on his part to admit that Trek is dying because of him.
He should just go off with his bitch Berman and do their new Sci-Fi series which will no doubt TANK!
This whole interview is more spin by a couple of guys who don't have a clue what to do anymore. They are just saying they are going to throw in the kitchen sink like this "Nazi" story line crap. But in fact they are just throwing out more crappy Trek. Hit the 100 episode mark, yank the series and package it up on DVD. Find some sucker fan to buy it for $100 bucks per season. No thanks!
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Scorned, whenever you make a point, you kill it by making 20 dumb statements. I have seen each of the majors (NBC, ABC, CBS, and FOX) draw up analyses of why their rating have declined. There's a reason they went to so many reality shows...as they started to lose audience to all of the cable channels and discovered that people loved to watch others suffer and get "voted off," they also figured out it was cheaper. The shows don't cost much to produce, so they can make money even with their lower average ratings. Of course they're all complaining about lower ratings, where have you been for the last five years.
Bat Out.
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Quote:" Scorned, whenever you make a point, you kill it by making 20 dumb statements."
Just 20? I figured I would dumb it down for people like yourself. But it is good to see that you agree with my point.
Quote:"Of course they're all complaining about lower ratings, where have you been for the last five years."
Having to sit through another "trend" in television. Do you not forgot the big " late night talk show craze, "day time talk show craze","court TV shows", "cartoon knock off os the Simpsons", "spin off programs" etc etc. These are all "fads" in televisions. When the fad starts to die down they come up something new for people to watch.
This reality TV is not even real. Anyone who believes this crap is real is a complete moron!! Next thing I am going to hear is that the WWE is real as well.
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Hi Scorned.
I have a question, and lets' try to be as fair as possible here: Would you actually like the show any better if B&B were to leave forever? Serious question.
I myself would like both of them to give the reigns over to the much more capable hands of Coto and Sussman, who both have a better understanding of pre-establish Trek lore (Sussman being a big fan of TOS and all). I won't fight with you about both of them needing to leave though.
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Quote:"Would you actually like the show any better if B&B were to leave forever? Serious question."
Serious answer:
Get some better writers,
have B&B removed like a bad case of warts,
tell Coto to KNOCK OFF the "homage" crap.
get RID of Daniels and T'Pol.
And MAYBE ENT would have a real chance. But until that time, no it is still shit.
(Errrr... Bill - LOL! 
)
From above:
Quote:
"It's an enormously complicated issue," Braga told journalist Ian Spelling. "There can be no doubt we've lost viewers, as have all the networks in general. You've got to put it in the context of ratings in general if you're going to compare the numbers for ENTERPRISE to the numbers for THE NEXT GENERATION, which is what most people do, without putting it in context. Very few people had cable and there was no satellite TV. Things are different now."
Ummmm.... contrary to Braga's popular belief, 50% of the U.S. HAD CABLE in 1987 when TNG premiered.
Perhaps BOZEMAN, MONTANA was a place where "very few people had cable and there was no satellite TV", because THAT is a place that the current 2000 census lists with a population of 27,509, almost 10,000 LESS than the population of the neighborhood I grew up in, and is located in a state that has the population of 902,195, which is a little more than HALF the population of my entire city.
There's probably more friggin' head of cattle out there than people. 
But this was certainly NOT the case on the East Coast of the U.S. which has twice the population of the west coast.
I mean hell, we were complaining in Philly about being one of the last large metropolitan areas TO get cable and that was before 1984 when our City Council finally came up with a franchising agreement with the local cable industry to equitably install cable city-wide here to supplement what had been running in several parts of the city since at least the 1970s. And in the interim, people had those mini-dishes up on their roof with HBO and Turner's Atlanta Superstation and all that jazz. And many even had the illegal hookups too. ;-) But again we're talking about the late '70s early '80s.
My cousins had cable in New Hampshire back in the late 1960s - early 1970s because they couldn't pick up the stations in Boston that well.
I got my cable hookup in 1986 and I've even had digital cable since 1999.
Time to get a clue bub.
And by the way, "satellite TV" has been around since 1976. I know... My godmother's nephews had a BIG ASS 6 ft satellite dish on the ROOF of their house and I got my first taste of "C-band" and watching how they used the remote to swing the thing around up there to get a signal in, as well as how they could pick up raw feeds coming from various places.
This wasn't last year. This was OVER 20 years ago.
How the HELL can you work in the industry and come out with a statement as if that damn 18" DirectTV or Dish network or Vroom service was somehow the beginning of "satellite TV"???? 
TRANSLATION:
I haven't learned the fine art of the bureaucratic B.S. that my boss/co-worker has learned but one day...
Quote:
"Having said that, we have lost a lot of our audience since ENTERPRISE premiered, and you can't deny that," he says. "Do you think it's because it's a bad show? Of course not.
Some might disagree. ;-)
Quote:
Even if ENTERPRISE is not your cup of tea, it's not a bad show. It's a quality show.
When you take a female character and you sanction the writing of stories that literally DESTROY that character's BRAIN in order to "change" her into some drugged-out fantasy PLAYTHING, THAT is not "quality".
Quote:
I think the fall in ratings is just because people have had enough of STAR TREK.
HUH????? How have "people.. had enough of Star Trek"? There are younger fans right here on this board who are just watching shows like DS9 for the first time. Some have never even seen TOS or only saw a few. Others are catching eps of TNG that they may have missed.
No, I think "people" have had enough of YOU.
TRANSLATION
I'm going to continue to point the finger of fault at EVERYONE and EVERYTHING ELSE but ME.
Quote:
Even when we do an episode like Twilight, it's still the 700th episode of STAR TREK."
It's more than that because you missed TAS. A show that kept Trek ALIVE aftewr 1969, airing a mere 4 years later. And I can go back and rewatch a TAS and be AMAZED at how much a D.C. Fontana could put in an episode that only had a running time of 22 minutes but YOUR episode will spend 22 minutes on neuropressure sessions and strip teases, essentially destroying the T'Pol character's ability to have ANY credibility whatsoever while now unable to even be a good 3rd party commentator and contrast character.
Quote:
Braga says he values the show's loyal audience and wonders whether a TREK series could ever regain the type of popularity seen at the height of TNG.
If you make it GOOD people will COME. Certainly the ratings of "The 4400" that Behr, Echevarria, and Wolfe - former co-workers of yours, produce, proved that point and I know that even I heard the buzz about the show from my co-workers.
Quote:
"All we can do is do the best job we can and value the four million people who are still watching ENTERPRISE loyally every week, which is nothing to sneeze at. It's not the glory days, but how could it be after so many years of continuous STAR TREK?"
Huh??????? There's a whole LARGE GROUP of "loyal" Star Trek fans who CONTINUE to buy the books (just look at the sales) and who are sitting out there right now refusing to watch ENT because of YOU. YOU and the "turn things on their ear" school of thought that might work for a story but NOT for a whole franchise's UNIVERSE.
TOS and TNG were shows that had family appeal. They didn't need nudity or toilet humor to attract an audience. And ENT doesn't need that EITHER.
ENT NEEDS SOMEONE WITH VISION and it's NOT YOU.
TRANSLATION:
I give up (but rather than step back and let someone else take the lead while I still collect a paycheck, I'm going to go down with the ship called Enterprise).
----
Scorned-style translations™ ©2004 All rights reserved.
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"I think the show talked to people through the characters. They're stories that speak to the heart. They talk about love, they talk about friendship, they talk about loyalty, they talk about patriotism, exploration, curiosity, reaching out... And I think all those things still touch people. Even when you look at a 30-year old show, it still has something to say." - D.C. Fontana, Sci Fi Channel Special Edition TOS 1998
----
"If the season finale involves the re-built USS Reliant coming back in time to the 21st Century crewed by Moogie, Dr. Selar, Morn, Transporter Chief Kyle, and the Salt Vampire, then we'll know that Coto has gone too far." - tomba1701
The fact of the matter is that different fans want different things. There are more than two types of fans here.
-People who love TOS but hate ENT
-People who can care less about TOS but love ENT
-People who love both TOS and ENT
-People who claim to be Trek fans but are really pissed off farscape or B5 fans. :)
On top of that, you have people who don't like ENT because its a prequel, people who don't like it because B&B are in charge, people who don't like it because they really believe the stories suck, and people who dislike it for all od the above.
When the producers do something right, they still get criticized. You see, Some of us Trek fans have something called "Too big of an ego". We have spent so much time criticizing B&B and have convinced ourselves and others that they are unable to produce anything good. The problem is, when they do something right and produce quality episodes, your prideful and egotistical fans refuse to acknowledge them and will do one of the following:
Thet will find some way to poke as many holes in the show and find as many reasons possible not to like it. Or, they will acknowledge that its good but give NO credit to B&B.
What I get out of this and past interviews with B&B are pleas to the fans asking us "What do you want us to do short of us quitting?" The third season of ENT clearly shows that they were attempting to give us what we want, but how can you satisfy a group of people who seem to want conflicting things?
My suggestion to all Trek fans is to tune into ENT and get as many people as u can to tune in. Whatever you don't like, by all means, complain about it and debate it. We have grabbed their attention. They are listening. Comming here and saying things like "B&B sucks and they should be fired" or "This ep or movie will stink because these two are in charge" is a waste of time and energy, because B&B will only loose their jobs whe Trek comes to an end. Your best option is to rationalize your thoughts and express in a civilized manner, your problems with an episode and what they can do to do better.
Captain out
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Very, very well said man. Thanks a lot for posting something with substance about this important issue. I'd much rather read something like this (something that talks to our intellect rather than our feelings) than I'll read a hateful post about any subject.
The problem is, of course, that you will be categorised as "B&B supporter" when you write something like this, thus giving you the look of the enemy, so some people will reject your thoughts without thinking twice.
But there is reason to keep thinking, for all of us, and not be so quick to point fingers at anyone, including those two people (B&B) who are doing their best to please us. This is also a matter of being kind, which I don't think is irrelevant. Wouldn't the world be a much better place if everyone was KIND to each other? The problems would be much easier to solve. It's a better way of communicating without putting stone after stone on the road - aggressive feelings on both sides are like stones that we stumble on, when we have to spend energy to calm down and stop throwing insane insults against each other. Better stay cool and on the subject. Don't let the negative feelings swallow you completely. Take it with a grain of salt. The downfall of Star Trek is very sad indeed, but bitching about it won't help. Constructive critisism may help.
-
Quote:
The fact of the matter is that different fans want different things. There are more than two types of fans here.
-People who love TOS but hate ENT
-People who can care less about TOS but love ENT
-People who love both TOS and ENT
-People who claim to be Trek fans but are really pissed off farscape or B5 fans. :)
Boy are you out of touch there babe.
Where are you getting this from? There are who knows how many posters here who love DS9. There are many even among the MASSES who watched and loved TNG. And there's even me who not only have watched and liked ALL of them (YES there are eps of ENT that I liked), but who also sing the praises of TAS. ;-)
Bottom line, don't be like THEM and try to "box" people into some little neat package.
There are fans out there right now who STILL attend conventions, buy the books and other merchandise and who might not watch ANY Star Trek at the moment. There are others who write fan fiction using existing characters or their own made up characters. And still others who actually TEACH KLINGON as part of linquistics programs.
The fandom is quite broad and diverse and contains many many different types of people.
Quote:
On top of that, you have people who don't like ENT because its a prequel, people who don't like it because B&B are in charge, people who don't like it because they really believe the stories suck, and people who dislike it for all od the above.
And guess what sweetheart, this is NOTHING NEW.
Quote:
When the producers do something right, they still get criticized.
And why shouldn't they be? NO ONE is beyond CRITICISM. It's the nature of LIFE. That includes YOU, ME, BRANNON BRAGA, MANNY COTO, RICK BERMAN, MIKE SUSSMAN, PHYLLIS STRONG, CHRIS BLACK, and YES, even GENE RODDENBERRY.
Welcome to REAL LIFE.™
(and THAT is what they get paid the big bucks for)
Quote:
You see, Some of us Trek fans have something called "Too big of an ego".
No, you see, PEOPLE have different OPINIONS. They take things as they come and interpret it based on their LIFE experiences and expectations. It has NOTHING to do with any text-book psychology "ego".
Quote:
We have spent so much time criticizing B&B and have convinced ourselves and others that they are unable to produce anything good. The problem is, when they do something right and produce quality episodes, your prideful and egotistical fans refuse to acknowledge them and will do one of the following:
Um no, the BOTTOM LINE is how the INDUSTRY treats the show. So when the science fiction INDUSTRY takes a look at what comes out of the franchise and decides WHO gets awards and who doesn't, THAT is what counts.
People aren't friggin Borg Drones. And don't try to think that they are.
You need to go back and look at some USENET archives and discover (surprise surprise) that the most popular Trek of ALL TIMES (ratings-wise) ALSO got CRITICIZED, almost as visciously as you see here. Imagine that.
It's part and parcel of the fandom - and of ANY fandom... Whether it be fans of a local sports team or fans of a horse named "Smarty Jones".
But NONE of this should preclude a writer from executing some thought process that goes beyond churning out run of the mill stuff week after week after week. Especially when we're in a situation like this with this show.
And many of us feel that the show has dumbed down and THAT has to STOP. You can't dumb down your characters in order to move the plot along week after week after week.
Quote:
Thet will find some way to poke as many holes in the show and find as many reasons possible not to like it. Or, they will acknowledge that its good but give NO credit to B&B.
Again, you need to get a clue and realize that critique is part and parcel of improvement. And ANY writer who doesn't take a serious look at the critiques, is going to be a failed writer in the end. Ie., it is VERY EASY to separate the wheat from the chaff of criticisms and find a way to address that.
Otherwise, you do nothing but shoot the messenger and the message that appears in writing on boards like this or as letters to the editor to a fan magazine, often represent the views of 100 or even 1000 OTHERS who saw the SAME weaknesses.
Quote:
What I get out of this and past interviews with B&B are pleas to the fans asking us "What do you want us to do short of us quitting?"
In this case, Berman has hired a NEW writer according to a News Item here. He is a VETERAN writer who has written award-winning episodes of VARIOUS genre shows and he can hopefully be allowed to contribute to this upcoming season.
Quote:
The third season of ENT clearly shows that they were attempting to give us what we want, but how can you satisfy a group of people who seem to want conflicting things?
What you fail to realize is that for a show such as Star Trek, what has "made" it acceptable to a large majority of fans, although they may disagree with individual episodes in different series, is A VISION. When you look at that interview with Behr, he TELLS YOU HIS VISION, what HE wanted to see in DS9. And he basically said he wanted to stop seeing happy happy Humans AND aliens and essentially felt that if not the Humans, at least the aliens should be in conflict with each other and Humanity. Now whether every fan exactly agreed with it all, is besides the point. The POINT is that HE had an idea of how he wanted to see the show develop.
Similarly, I have quoted Herb Solow's comments here regarding Gene Coon and HIS VISION, where apparently Coon said - "stop shooting what people think of as 'monsters' and start treating them as if they were an intelligent being like Humans". Which was DIFFERENT from RODDENBERRY'S VISION (essentially evolving from the shoot-em-up cowboy and cop show background that he had). And Coon added some fascinating stuff in TOS that the FANS take for granted.
And of course, we all know that Roddenberry had that "original VISION" to jump start what would become a billion dollar franchise that takes in some $200,000,000 yearly.
And THAT is what is lacking with ENT is VISION.
And the question to ask is this (which I have asked BEFORE on these forums):
WHERE DO THE PRODUCERS WANT TO SEE THE SHOW GO?
WHAT MESSAGE DO YOU WANT WE THE AUDIENCE TO HAVE ABOUT HUMANITY?
Quote:
My suggestion to all Trek fans is to tune into ENT and get as many people as u can to tune in.
That's going to be hard because the average person out there has no clue that ENT is even a "Star Trek". And as I have mentioned many times before here, I have an ENT calendar on my wall at work and when people ask me who those people are, I tell them, I tell them about the show, and I tell them when it is on (ASSUMING they don't switch it up on me... )
But there's just a blank stare and well I tried and those of us Trek fans at work sortof chalk it up but will at least be seen discussing it publicly whenever.... ;-)
Quote:
Whatever you don't like, by all means, complain about it and debate it. We have grabbed their attention. They are listening.
Some are "listening" and I've seen it first hand. But not all. ;-) And in fact, the one who isn't "listening" is the very one who will out of spite go even further into the wrong direction when called on it.
But you know what they say about people who cut off their noses to spite their face. ;-)
Quote:
Comming here and saying things like "B&B sucks and they should be fired" or "This ep or movie will stink because these two are in charge" is a waste of time and energy, because B&B will only loose their jobs whe Trek comes to an end.
Huh? Have you ever heard of the First Amendment of the Constitution, which applies on this board considering that it is located in a city here in the U.S.?
;-)
Quote:
Your best option is to rationalize your thoughts and express in a civilized manner, your problems with an episode and what they can do to do better.
People HAVE done this for the past 3 years.
But as they say, you can lead a horse to water but you can't make 'em drink. ;-)
Quote:
Captain out
Methinks that "Captain" needs to get a clue. ;-)
--------
"I think the show talked to people through the characters. They're stories that speak to the heart. They talk about love, they talk about friendship, they talk about loyalty, they talk about patriotism, exploration, curiosity, reaching out... And I think all those things still touch people. Even when you look at a 30-year old show, it still has something to say." - D.C. Fontana, Sci Fi Channel Special Edition TOS 1998
----
"If the season finale involves the re-built USS Reliant coming back in time to the 21st Century crewed by Moogie, Dr. Selar, Morn, Transporter Chief Kyle, and the Salt Vampire, then we'll know that Coto has gone too far." - tomba1701
-
Haha haha Jadzia darling, did I touch a nerve? And I expected better from you..:)
Well let's see...
Quote:
Boy are you out of touch there babe.
Where are you getting this from? There are who knows how many posters here who love DS9. There are many even among the MASSES who watched and loved TNG. And there's even me who not only have watched and liked ALL of them (YES there are eps of ENT that I liked), but who also sing the praises of TAS. ;-)
Bottom line, don't be like THEM and try to "box" people into some little neat package.
Thank you for serving my point. There are many many different fans with different expectations and diiferent "wants".
Quote:
And why shouldn't they be? NO ONE is beyond CRITICISM. It's the nature of LIFE. That includes YOU, ME, BRANNON BRAGA, MANNY COTO, RICK BERMAN, MIKE SUSSMAN, PHYLLIS STRONG, CHRIS BLACK, and YES, even GENE RODDENBERRY.
Welcome to REAL LIFE.™
(and THAT is what they get paid the big bucks for)
True, I used the wrong word. Perhaps "Trashed" is a more suitable word. But since I seem to have confused you, let me simplify. Any Star Trek episode that B&B produce, no matter how great it is, even if its the greatest most compelling story ever told, will always be trashed by those who despise B&B.
Quote:
No, you see, PEOPLE have different OPINIONS. They take things as they come and interpret it based on their LIFE experiences and expectations. It has NOTHING to do with any text-book psychology "ego".
Again, any Star Trek episode that B&B produce, no matter how great it is, even if its the greatest most compelling story ever told, will always be trashed by those who despise B&B.
Even if they liked it, they are too big to admit it and will find a way to Trash it. I'll give you an example. Tell me what you consider to be the greatest Trek episode ever, and I'll rewatch it. And within a few days I'll trash it, even though it may be one I like.
Quote:
People aren't friggin Borg Drones. And don't try to think that they are.
Now you are insulting me. I never said they were. I don't expect every trek fan to like the show. I do expect them to be reasonable in their "critiques". I am referring to fans who trash for the sake of trashing.
Quote:
You need to go back and look at some USENET archives and discover (surprise surprise) that the most popular Trek of ALL TIMES (ratings-wise) ALSO got CRITICIZED, almost as visciously as you see here. Imagine that.
yeah but they didn't tune out. Trek fans have gotten too spoiled. They cry and expect to get what they want. Well sorry, In the real world, everyone can not get what they want. USENET wasn't as nearly as popular back then as the Internet is today. Even though though the Internet still represents a small percentage of fan opinions, imagine the percentage that thos old usenet boards represented.
It's part and parcel of the fandom - and of ANY fandom... Whether it be fans of a local sports team or fans of a horse named "Smarty Jones".
But NONE of this should preclude a writer from executing some thought process that goes beyond churning out run of the mill stuff week after week after week. Especially when we're in a situation like this with this show.
Quote:
Otherwise, you do nothing but shoot the messenger and the message that appears in writing on boards like this or as letters to the editor to a fan magazine, often represent the views of 100 or even 1000 OTHERS who saw the SAME weaknesses.
expample of critique:
This episode had its shortcomings. While I enjoyed [blah blah blah], its my opinion that [blah blah blah] should have been done instead of [blah blah blah].
example of Trash:
Fuck B&B they are worthles fuck who cant run a show and cant write. This whole episode sucked and all who disagree are lames.
Quote:
Huh? Have you ever heard of the First Amendment of the Constitution, which applies on this board considering that it is located in a city here in the U.S.?
huh? where did this come from? I simply said that its a waste of time. I never said that they didn't have the right to come here and be silly. Though they have the freedom to, doesn't make it right. Thats my point.
Quote:
People HAVE done this for the past 3 years.
correction: SOME People HAVE done this for the past 3 years.
Not all.
Quote:
Methinks that "Captain" needs to get a clue. ;-)
As you can see, all of my clues are in order. How about yours?
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Quote:
Haha haha Jadzia darling, did I touch a nerve? And I expected better from you..:)
Better? What is better?
Quote:
Well let's see...
Thank you for serving my point. There are many many different fans with different expectations and diiferent "wants".
But your examples are rather narrow.
Quote:
Welcome to REAL LIFE.™
(and THAT is what they get paid the big bucks for)
True, I used the wrong word. Perhaps "Trashed" is a more suitable word. But since I seem to have confused you, let me simplify. Any Star Trek episode that B&B produce, no matter how great it is, even if its the greatest most compelling story ever told, will always be trashed by those who despise B&B.
And that is the way of the world, as Earth, Wind, & Fire were wont to say. ;-)
I wouldn't take it personally to heart and neither should you.
Quote:
Again, any Star Trek episode that B&B produce, no matter how great it is, even if its the greatest most compelling story ever told, will always be trashed by those who despise B&B.
Even if they liked it, they are too big to admit it and will find a way to Trash it. I'll give you an example. Tell me what you consider to be the greatest Trek episode ever, and I'll rewatch it. And within a few days I'll trash it, even though it may be one I like.
Why do you insist on not allowing people to put their personal takes on things out on public forums? Isn't that the point of a discussion board? Who cares if they do what you consider as "trash" something? Certainly many people hate when folks overly gush over such.
Quote:
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People aren't friggin Borg Drones. And don't try to think that they are.
Now you are insulting me. I never said they were. I don't expect every trek fan to like the show. I do expect them to be reasonable in their "critiques". I am referring to fans who trash for the sake of trashing.
But again, does it really matter in the scheme of things? I mean really?
Quote:
Quote:
You need to go back and look at some USENET archives and discover (surprise surprise) that the most popular Trek of ALL TIMES (ratings-wise) ALSO got CRITICIZED, almost as visciously as you see here. Imagine that.
yeah but they didn't tune out.
If you look at the ratings, some tuned out some tuned in, some switched to DS9, blah blah. Certainly DS9's premier having garnered the highest rating of any Trek episode is telling.
Quote:
Trek fans have gotten too spoiled.
I don't think so. I think they have been exposed to more and more sci fi offerings and are seeing others leading a pack where Trek used to be in that position (except perhaps what I just watched with the repeat airing of the 8th season premier of Stargate-SG1 which appeared to be nothing but Star Trek with a different name... geez).
Quote:
They cry and expect to get what they want. Well sorry, In the real world, everyone can not get what they want. USENET wasn't as nearly as popular back then as the Internet is today.
But you don't understand. The USENET groups and the Trek mailing lists ARE the internet as it was BEFORE the "world wide web". You would probably find more posters there than on any of the Trek forums - mainly due to the accessibility of the text format and how long those discussion venues have been around - over 20 years.
Quote:
Even though though the Internet still represents a small percentage of fan opinions, imagine the percentage that thos old usenet boards represented.
Were you on them? Why are you guessing? The fact that they are text-based originally using newsreaders (and recently are web-accessible thanks to Google), then they were the main electronic forum for so many colleges and universities and all the dialup folks.
Go through them
Quote:
expample of critique:
This episode had its shortcomings. While I enjoyed [blah blah blah], its my opinion that [blah blah blah] should have been done instead of [blah blah blah].
example of Trash:
Fuck B&B they are worthles fuck who cant run a show and cant write. This whole episode sucked and all who disagree are lames.
But does this really matter? People are expressing what they feel. That's why I say, someone who is truly interested in critique will get out of it what they will.
Quote:
Quote:
Huh? Have you ever heard of the First Amendment of the Constitution, which applies on this board considering that it is located in a city here in the U.S.?
huh? where did this come from? I simply said that its a waste of time. I never said that they didn't have the right to come here and be silly. Though they have the freedom to, doesn't make it right. Thats my point.
And they may feel the same way about you and would express as much. ;-)
Quote:
Quote:People HAVE done this for the past 3 years.
correction: SOME People HAVE done this for the past 3 years.
Not all.
I don't see "all" in my sentence and wonder why you do.
Quote:
Quote:
Methinks that "Captain" needs to get a clue. ;-)
As you can see, all of my clues are in order. How about yours?
No, I think you have a ways to go. ;-)
--------
"I think the show talked to people through the characters. They're stories that speak to the heart. They talk about love, they talk about friendship, they talk about loyalty, they talk about patriotism, exploration, curiosity, reaching out... And I think all those things still touch people. Even when you look at a 30-year old show, it still has something to say." - D.C. Fontana, Sci Fi Channel Special Edition TOS 1998
----
"If the season finale involves the re-built USS Reliant coming back in time to the 21st Century crewed by Moogie, Dr. Selar, Morn, Transporter Chief Kyle, and the Salt Vampire, then we'll know that Coto has gone too far." - tomba1701
This is so disappoint and yet to typical. I can't believe UPN is keeping Braga involved with Enterprise. If you would look at the success of the creative talent the Berman and Braga have chased away from the Trek franchise and see the success of ventures such as the new Battlestar Galactica and The 4400, they would realize that the problem is Berman and Braga. I hope there's still a chance to get him booted and revive the franchise with new blood, but the powers that be at UPN don't seem to be any smarter than these two.
Quote:
"Do you think it's because it's a bad show? "
Um.. Yeah...
EDIT: I'd just like to say I think that whole spiel would have come off a lot better if it was from Cotto. While I don't think Cotto will be able to do much to save ENT, this article sounds like Braga shoveling some stuff to the suits so he won't get fired. He needs to save the CYA talk for the boardroom, and talk straight with the fans.
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The supervisor is Verizon!
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"It's an enormously complicated issue,"
Brannon, Brannon, Brannon.
It's really NOT complicated. You suck and nobody is tuning in. It's very simple.
Go get another job for PETE's SAKE!!! Let someone with some new ideas at the helm!
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Quack!!!
Quote:
I think the fall in ratings is just because people have had enough of STAR TREK.
No Brannon, it's not that people have had enough of Star Trek. People have had enough of YOUR Star Trek.
People stopped watching ENT because YOU didn't tell enough compelling stories, at least during the first two seasons.
Just needed to set that straight!
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Beware of the Leopard
...this sounds like a job for one of Jadzia-Dax's well-placed analyses and cutting to the truth.
In the words of Spock from ST IV, are we sure it isn't time for a colorful metaphor? :)
Hey Brannon how about something new for a change to regain interest instead of the same old tired formula?
-
I'd call him a washed-up fanboy he's even too worthless for such a greasy description. I can't think straight I'm so f#*king mad after reading that story. He's a little prick who got a job that thousands of fans would be willing to do anything to have and continues to keep that job by writing gobs of Hollywood style Horses#!t ,and THEN, slap the franchise name all over it.
Enough about this a$$monkey! StarFleet Captain right about all the complaining on this board and how it doesn't do any good. If the loyal have to go back to enjoying Trek in re-runs and literature for a number of years, SO BE IT! We'll stay loyal until someone else in Hollywood or wherever emerges to take a chance on Star Trek the way it was meant to be before they resorted to Captains that de-evolve into lizards and mate with helm officers and Horney, drug addict Vulcans with huge Boobs (not that I have a problem with boobs!).
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i like grapes
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