Call me simple, but I always like the mutiny episode. True, the main focus was on the bug babies, but any time a captain is "under the influence" (whatever that influence may be...) and the crew has to mutiny, you know I'm on the edge of my seat.
I really enjoyed hatchery. Dont know why the critics are so harsh on this show ... I love it!
The eggs wern't the only thing sleeping in "The Hatchery" .
Normally i have no problem watching Enterprise, even though it's evening viewing time falls when I'm normally fast alseep and resting for my third shift work schedule.
This time however, I couldn't help but find myself drifting off now & again.
While it wasn't a bad episode, It surely wasn't very riveting in my opinion either.
I was impressed with the performance of Captain Archer however. So many times, during these episodes with "mind control" or some other outside controlling influence, characters who have been taken over seem to be "over the top" and exagerated with their actions. While this may be the actual case were something like this to actually happen, I feel that much of the time, any sort of controlling influence would attempt to be more subtle. A greatly written and performed episode in this respect.
The setup to the crew entering the Zindi Insectoid hatchery had a Aliens feel to it. The away team calmly walking into the hatchery. Positioning themselves far too closely to the eggs sacks. The inevitable contamination occuring.
I thought that the pacing of Archer's transformation to surrogate parent to the hatchlings was quite effective. And since Archer was unaware of the change, he suffered no tortured, emotional conflict. It was interesting watching the crew slowly realize that their personal safety was becoming secondary to the Captain. The senior officers having to deal with the situation without Archer's support was a new experience for them. And it was discovered why T'Pol is the executive officer. Because, it was her quiet strength, her leadership that made the retaking of the ship possible.
In the end, the Maco Major did finally become more of a member of the crew only after the incident was resolved because of the understanding reached by Reed and himself. I believe that the Major will become more involved with staff decisions as he should be. If the Major had been informed and saw Archer's transformation, the incident could have been resolved sooner.
This episode had the worst pre-credits teaser in the history of the show.
Now, not only do the teasers last a few seconds, but they fail to do what they are supposed to do - grab the attention of the viewer.
I can't comment on the rest of the episode, as Enterprise doesn't deserve an uninterrupted hour of my time any more.
I think it was a decent episode. I enjoyed watching it but the episode was not extraordinary which is what enterprise really needs to spike the ratings up
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"The mighty Star Trek would fall before us"-B&B
Decent, solid, predictable episode. But did anyone else notice that the tension between Reed and Hayes seemed a little sexual. Reed eyed him up and down while they were coversing in a way that totally made me feel like he wanted him. Maybe thats just Dominic Keating and his showtime/soft-core porn/chromiumblue.com style of acting.
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Decent, solid, predictable episode. But did anyone else notice that the tension between Reed and Hayes seemed a little sexual. Reed eyed him up and down while they were coversing in a way that totally made me feel like he wanted him. Maybe thats just Dominic Keating and his showtime/soft-core porn/chromiumblue.com style of acting.
Yeah, I noticed the same thing, and was disturbed by it. Overall, a decent episode. I do agree with the comments about the crew looking dumb in this ep. I can't believe it took them that long to figure out that Archer had been infected.
When I first learned that this episode actually involved Archer under undue alien influence, rather than my original assumption that he would try to use the hatchery to gain a tactical advantage, I was disappointed. I had thought a desperate Archer might try to do something to the Insectoid hatchlings to gain an advantage in the war against the Xindi, and that the crew's mutiny was in response to the captain finally taking his unethical behavior over the edge. In fact, the episode was just the opposite, and I think it worked very well.
"Hatchery" took advantage of the divided loyalties of the MACOs and the Starfleet crew, something I'd been hoping for since word of their arrival on the show last summer. Since Hayes has received a good bit of development lately, this plot worked very well in depicting the loyalty of Hayes to Archer and the tension with Reed. Hayes and Reed's final scene in sickbay was very effective to this end.
As someone else pointed out, at every point along the way, Archer's pleas for saving the hatchlings seemed to make sense. Despite the delay, it was plausible that saving them could prove a future tactical advantage. Of course once the issue of transferring Enterprise's anti-matter reserves comes into the picture, it's clear that Archer is out of bounds. The final scene with the insectoids running all over him is what really hammers it home and the mutinty etc. was handled well.
I have a couple quibbles: Eugenics Wars seem to be getting coalesced into World War III mythology. This indicates a lack of clearly defined backstory. Maybe they should have (when developing ENT) gone back and actually written a lot of backstory for all this so that they could keep everything straight, rather than make it more convoluted with every reference.
I have no problem with the away team removing their helmets, but if that was the only pressurized room, shouldn't it have been depressurized when Archer and Hayes arrived the first time and opened the door while the rest of the crew inside still have their helmets off?
How do they tow things in this era? Tow cables? OK, but they just hang right off the back of the shuttlepod through the impulse exhaust?
In any case, definitely one of the better episodes of the season. A good bottle show that used the unique Xindi situation to explore important questions about the MACOs and the ethics of the mission in general.
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It's a rip-off. / We're stepped on, and cheated! / We're flat, stone-cold lied to / But we're not defeated / No!
Halen. "The Dream is Over."
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This wasn't one of the greatest episodes by any stretch, but I agree with you Steve that this type of episode stands up during the year. And to be honest this series hasn't had a lot of those. This was STAR TREK pure and simple. And instead of trying to shock the world every week -- more stuff like this with the occasional spectacular all out "event" episode-- and they'd be getting back on the right track.
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I have a couple quibbles: Eugenics Wars seem to be getting coalesced into World War III mythology. This indicates a lack of clearly defined backstory. Maybe they should have (when developing ENT) gone back and actually written a lot of backstory for all this so that they could keep everything straight, rather than make it more convoluted with every reference.
I think they intentionally left it vague. The writers sort of have a no win situation with the Eugenics Wars. Many hardcore fans (myself included) want them to follow the TOS continuity and put the wars in the 1990s, while others want the Trek timeline to be as close to our own as possible (not to mention the casual fans who will be confused about a war in the 1990s). The reference in this episode can work both ways. It's theoratically possible for Archer's great grandfather to have been around in the 1990s, so there is no direct violation of TOS continuity. But as you said, it could also be interpreted that the war happend later and it may have been the same as WW-III.
Of course the Eugenics Wars was already a mess with DS9 putting it in the 22nd century (thanks to a script goof by Ron Moore).
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Could you please continue the petty bickering? I find it most intriguing.
Although the episode had some decent moments, "Hatchery" lost me in the beginning because I think, once again, it makes the crew look stupid. This is especially disappointing considering the string of recent episodes where they were written much better ("Proving Ground," "Stratagem," "Harbinger"). I began to get annoyed the moment they started taking off their helmets in this alien environment before determining if there were any bio-hazards. Why would they do this? To conserve oxygen? (No, to get infected, of course.) But what really pissed me off is when Archer starts acting whacky and risking the mission to find the Xindi weapon, no one says, "Hmmm, maybe it has something to do with him getting sprayed by that alien whatever. Maybe we should check a little closer." It isn't until very late in the episode (and long after he relieves T'Pol of her duties) that they begin to do this. As Star Trek fans we know exactly what's happening and how it's going to turn out. We have to watch while the crew run around in circles and finally start to figure out something we knew from the beginning. I think it makes the crew look dumb and bores the audience. And I really, really want the crew to look and act intelligent--it's much more entertaining.
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I liked the episode, but I don't think it was as strong as it could have been.
At first, Archer's orders seemed typical of a *Federation* starship captain. Saving alien lives in the hatchery, even enemy alien lives, is something we'd expect from a Federation starship captain.
But, as the episode went along, you knew the venom was affecting his judgment.
I wonder if it would have been more interesting if the crew had gone along with his orders, but Major Hayes and the MACOs, maybe eventually along with Doctor Phlox, were the ones to realize something was wrong.
The crew, being explorers initially, would seem to be more apt to follow the Captain's orders to save the hatchery than would the MACOs have been as apt to follow the Captain's orders to basically put their primary mission in jeopardy.
I think that would have made for a more believable plot.
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I agree. I found it predictable and boring. I know I'm losing interest when I'm in no hurry to rush back to the show after the commercials are over. Except for Proving Ground, which I thought was a fantastic episode, the recent shows have been a disappointment. The show has to be consistently good for viewers to keep coming back.
As for the survival of the show, I'm sure UPN is asking itself, "Can we get a better return on our investment with another show?" Enterprise isn't cheap to produce and if UPN can come up with a cheap exploitive "reality" show that will get better ratings, then Enterprise is doomed.
It's all about money.
...to Mike Sussman. This is the guy that bring TREK back....
"including a long-awaited one to the Eugenics Wars, even if Archer does make it sound more like a UN peacekeeping mission than the hell and horror of WWIII."
Well, the Eugenics Wars did happened in the early-mid 90's and if all those little conflicts that happen during that time were actually the secret Eugenics War, Archer's quote is correct.
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"Take a Romulan chill pill and have some faith!"
-Erik Jendresen, writer of Star Trek: The Beginning
"No bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country."
-General George S. Patton Jr.
"I am NOT Scorned."
-Scorned as Gage/Gage_2
Remember our little discussion about TOS "Turnabout Intruder"? Same sort of story setup here in ENT "Hatchery", where you have:
1.) Captain is impacted by [insert plot device here].
2.) Captain's initial behavior is somewhat unusual but not too far out initially to generate too much concern.
3.) Over time, Captain's behavior becomes increasingly erratic causing concern by some of the crew and illicits requests for a medical examination.
4.) Captain is reluctant but Doctor manages to run multiple tests (by consent in TOS "Turnabout Intruder" and by stealth methods in ENT "Hatchery") and the results indicate "nothing wrong" with Captain.
5.) Captain's behavior gets worse and crew begin to openly object.
6.) Crew begins to act insubordinate when given orders that would negatively impact the ship and crew, First Officer is the one to inform the Captain of the Captain's egregious violations and dereliction of duty, and Captain relieves First Officer from duty (and in TOS's case, Captain calls for a followup trial where execution is eventually ordered and in ENT's case, the First Officer is confined to quarters under MACO guard).
7.) Crew bands together to mutiny, the mutiny is discovered by the Captain, and more crew are "relieved" of duty.
8.) Crew manages to disrupt the Captain's actions and disable the Captain.
9.) Captain is "cured" of the [insert plot device] that caused the abberant behavior.
10.) Captain is no worse for the wear, but the crew is somewhat disillusioned anyway, but glad the ordeal is over.
Now this WAS the very setup for what I believe you said you considered as the WORST ep of TOS (albeit alongside what alot of folks hated - TOS "Spock's Brain"). Yet the execution of ENT "Hatchery", effectively took the EXACT SAME PLOT FORMULA used in TOS "Turnabout Intruder", and executed it differently to make it a better episode.
And so Sussman, just like he did with TOS "Spock's Brain", supposedly the fan favorite as the WORST episode of TOS - creates ENT "Dead Stop", a much better rendering and execution of the TOS version. And so he does the SAME with TOS "Turnabout Intruder", again, one of fandom's WORST TOS eps, to create ENT "Hatchery", a much better reworking.
And as a side note and twist on the storyline of TOS "Turnabout Intruder", Archer is "turned about" to become the "woman"/"mother" of the Insectoid hatchlings, like Kirk was "turned about" to become the woman Janice Lester.
(ha ha Sussman)
Interesting. ;-)
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"I think the show talked to people through the characters. They're stories that speak to the heart. They talk about love, they talk about friendship, they talk about loyalty, they talk about patriotism, exploration, curiosity, reaching out... And I think all those things still touch people. Even when you look at a 30-year old show, it still has something to say." - D.C. Fontana, Sci Fi Channel Special Edition TOS 1998
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"If the season finale involves the re-built USS Reliant coming back in time to the 21st Century crewed by Moogie, Dr. Selar, Morn, Transporter Chief Kyle, and the Salt Vampire, then we'll know that Coto has gone too far." - tomba1701
"Hatchery" brought up an issues about the MACOs that has been bothering me all season. These are supposed to be commando space marines, trained just for combat. How is it that Malcolm and his security team can best them so easily? Also, I gotten say, Steven Culp has a lot more presence than the other actors on the show - no wonder he's getting more acting gigs. And another thing: I love T'Pol in uniform. I know she can't be the first Vulcan in Starfleet (that would be Spock, as far as I remember), but she looks much better when she's not dressed like Catwoman from Space.
... but their math was a bit off. Maybe Archer left out a couple of "great"s in saying his "great-grandfather" fought in the war.
Other than that, a predictable and solidly average episode.
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"but their math was a bit off. Maybe Archer left out a couple of "great"s in saying his "great-grandfather" fought in the war."
No, it's possible for his great-grandfather to have fought in the Eugenics Wars. But if it was actually his Great-Great Grandfather, it's okay if he did leave out a 'great', we've all done that from time to time.
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"Take a Romulan chill pill and have some faith!"
-Erik Jendresen, writer of Star Trek: The Beginning
"No bastard ever won a war by dying for his country. He won it by making the other poor dumb bastard die for his country."
-General George S. Patton Jr.
"I am NOT Scorned."
-Scorned as Gage/Gage_2
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Turnabout Intruder Vs Hatchery
Enterprise matches original Trek with number of episodes, seems only natural the #69 of both series would have the same plot, call it an 'homage'.;~}
I have enjpoyed the last few episodes moreso than the beginning of this season. Even Mayweather seems to have Woken up a bit.
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Turnabout Intruder Vs Hatchery
Enterprise matches original Trek with number of episodes, seems only natural the #69 of both series would have the same plot, call it an 'homage'.;~}
Not quite. TOS Prod. #69 (at least according to what I use also confirmed here) was TOS "That Which Survives". TOS "Turnabout Intruder" was literally the last episode (#79) that was filmed and that was confirmed by Shatner on the commentary from my SE tape. He said they had a wrap party that last day (January 9, 1969). It wasn't shown until May.
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I have enjpoyed the last few episodes moreso than the beginning of this season. Even Mayweather seems to have Woken up a bit.
Well.. because some efforts have been made to develop some more Xindi. And yes, it's good to see Travis. Considering his background of being born and raised in space on a freighter should mean that he has alot of practical experience, even if the tech is higher than what he grew up with, the principles should be the same (plus he has been trained).
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"I think the show talked to people through the characters. They're stories that speak to the heart. They talk about love, they talk about friendship, they talk about loyalty, they talk about patriotism, exploration, curiosity, reaching out... And I think all those things still touch people. Even when you look at a 30-year old show, it still has something to say." - D.C. Fontana, Sci Fi Channel Special Edition TOS 1998
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"If the season finale involves the re-built USS Reliant coming back in time to the 21st Century crewed by Moogie, Dr. Selar, Morn, Transporter Chief Kyle, and the Salt Vampire, then we'll know that Coto has gone too far." - tomba1701
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