Is Rick Berman scared that if he brought Shatner/Kirk back to the series and the ratings/box office took off that the public would be in essence saying we don't want your version of Star Trek?
Wouldn't a box office hit or a huge ratings upswing due to Shatner/Kirk basically being saying that we as the viewing public want what we perceive as the real Star Trek back and not your watered down version?
I truly believe that Berman wants no part of what Kirk could do for Star Trek because it would being saying his version of the Trek universe is not as good or as popular as Kirk's version.
Captain Kirk is a pop culture legend. He is in the same class as Indiana Jones and James Bond.
Why wouldn't tptb bring Star Trek's greatest icon back when the franchise needs him the most?
Look at all the intrest Kirk has been getting on this board and others like it.
As much as I enjoyed Enterprise this season, and all the various incarnations of Star Trek. We as fans must admit the the broad fanbase Star Trek once enjoyed belonged to Kirk not Archer or Janeway or Sisko.
I really feel the best way to get the millions of Star Trek fans back in the fold would be to have Star Trek 11 be a Kirk/Spock adventure.
I say bring back the legend one more time.
With well over 100 replies, this article has generated more responses than any trekweb articles this year with the exception of the Enterprise cancellation and the Jendresen Star Trek XI news.
Shatner is still going strong, if they ever did bring him back as Kirk it would be sure to generate even more interest in the masses who aren't represented here.
There just seems to be so much intrest in the return of Captain Kirk. Why don't they just film his return for the next film?
I know where I work people couldn't really care less about Enterprise. But when it was mentioned in a news article that William Shatner was going to reprise his role as Kirk the entrie office was buzzing about it.
Shatner is clearly Star Trek's biggest star. Doesn't it make sense to bring him back in some form?
I really don't think the new crew prequel idea is going to do well (even though I think it might be kinda of cool)
Is there any chance Captain Kirk could be brought back for Star Trek 11 or even a mini series about the upcoming 40th anniversary?
I for one would love to see it and I think it would create much good will for the series.
Its been a while since I watched Generations, but didn't Kirk die? I know a lot of people want to see Kirk/Shatner return to Star Trek. But I think people have to give up on the notion of ressurecting Kirk. The character died in 1994. Time to move on here. Enterprise was a good way to bring Shatner back, but its gone. Let it be.
I liked the idea that Shatner pitched about the Mirror Universe Kirk. Perhaps he will use this idea for a new book in the near future.
The one subject that seems to really hit home with people in regards to Star Trek is the return of Captain Kirk to the series.
This subject has gone on for years and years in Star Trek circles. You can trace this debate nearly to the date that Star Trek started to lose it's popularity with the general public.
It seems there is little if any intrest in the last few series from the general public.
Wouldn't it be a no brainer to have Star Trek 11 focus on the return of Captain Kirk?
It would be easy enough to get him out of the nexus time ribbon (or whatever it is)
Kirk's return surely would bring more people to the cinema than a film with an unknown cast written by Mr Berman and Mr Braga.
I would have one last adveture with Kirk and Spock post Generations with a new crew.
It would bring people back to Star Trek and it could serve as a good jumping off point for that crew that would work with Kirk and Spock in Trek 11.
Surely everyone knows that Kirk and Spock are not the future of the series. But their star power could bring people back to the series and give the next crew a fighting chance.
Any thoughts?
This vitriolic hatred towards Berman, justified or not, is clouding your ability to read. The article clearly states that the Chef idea was Mike Sussman's, and Berman was merely relating it to Shatner - it doesn't even say that it was an idea he prefered, but that's what everyone is gleefully assuming. Read more carefully next time - this childish behavior is pathetic.
I LOVE IT!!!!!!!
It totally shows how Berman is a complete and utter moron!!!!! Shatner... my GOD... SHATNER... comes up with a brilliant idea... and RICK "I'm a moron" BERMAN has this other totally RIDICULOUS idea and it kills negotiations UTTERLY.
HAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!! Anyone... holy SH*T... ANYONE who cannot see how much Berman is completely out of his depth and is probably going senile by this point should really check into some sort of mental health facility because it is totally quite obvious to me by this point that the man is way way... WAY out of his league here.
Get Berman the hell away from Star Trek, put him on some sort of medication and check him into a mental health facility because it's quite clear he's incompetant and totally unable to handle the intricatcies of a major science fiction franchise.
The chef thing is just an insult, a deal breaker from the word go, I can just see the pregnant pause in the negotiations. Ridiculous.
The Tantalus field thing presupposes that at some point someone, presumably Spock, sent Kirk back to our universe. Huh? A benevolent Mirror universe sent the evil Kirk back? Huh?
This one sounds like they're either trying to make Kirk responsible for an entire universe of evil or they're invalidating him totally.
Neither would have been any good. Neither restores the real Kirk, just as many of the posters knew would not happen.
The more I think I think about it the Tantalus thing is just absurd. The other idea isn't worthy of comment.
The first idea sounded good but the Berman idea (why am I surprised?) sounded horrible. God, I wish BErman would jump off a building or something.
Why didn't Berman just tell Kirk to fuck off? That would've been less subtle than having Shatner play Chef. Is Berman really that stupid or was he just trying to make it bad to turn off Shatner? The mirror universe idea was cool, but Berman's was just god-awful. Instead of a long silence, Shatner should've just got up and left.
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"Maybe in another thousand years, we'll have teleportation and all that other Star Trek stuff. But with our current technology, we can't even make William Shatner's hair look real." --- Bill Maher
Don't they GET IT?
Kirk, we wanted KIRK. Not some mirror universe or chef impersonation???
My GOD!
Idiots. ALL of them. Total and utter bloody idiots.
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"Men don't use sex to get what they want. Sex IS what they want" - Frasier
This PRISONER OF ZENDA device been used for ages now --- they wanted to make some kind of galactic MOON OVER PARADOR or some Jerry Lewis film with mixed identities.
what the hell does Rick Berman have on the Paramount executives that they keep him on the Trek bandwagon even atfer 2 series and 2 movie flops?!?
Does he have pictures of them in compromising positions?
That really wasn't Berman's idea, was it? That's a joke, right?
I am speechless.
It looks like an awfully bad attempt at humor.
But even if it is i do not appreaciate it.
But I still hope that it is... couse if it isn“t it is not funny at all!
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"That is the exploration that awaits you: Not mapping the stars and studying nebulae, but charting the unknown possiblities of existence." - Q, All Good Things...
Berman's idea was horrible. The other one is kind of neat though.
I've never been one to jump on the 'let's bash Berman' bandwagon but let's face it: The man is a creatively bankrupt dick.
My lord. The differences in the ideas is appalling. One is just great. The other is... chef??!!! Yeah, I can't see it. Sorry. Horrible idea.
Can someone explain. How could Tiberious have been setn back in time to a point where his Universe didnt exist? And how does this story jibe with what we know from the DS9 mirror episodes.
Even if they could make it logical it would still be an anti-climactic use of Shatner. Kirk and Archer sitting at a trasnporter control for the hour. Where's the human drama. It would probably be played for laughs.
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I'd really like to know what made Rick Berman believe that Shatner as Chef would be a better idea than Shatner as Tiberius. Unless he was intentionally trying to kill the idea, the better story between the two is a no brainier.
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That very possibly could have been the coolest episode of Star Trek since DS9 went off the air. I'd've even tuned in for that one.
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--Phil Hartman as McCoy, Saturday Night Live
Hey everyone, lighten up a bit. It's only a bad joke about Chef. Sussman is the one telling the joke and he said that he was the one who devised the idea, not Berman. He said Berman only pitched the idea ... it's a joke. A very bad joke, but still a joke.
HAHAHAHA this is truly the proof that Rick Berman is a fucking idiot!
Chef! hahahahaa
No wonder Shatner didnt join. ROFL
Man in my life ive never seen a franchise head who is so intent on defecating on his own franchise.
Bloody hell...I cant believe this...Chef! Impersonating Kirk in a ceremony. Is Rick Berman really this moronic?!
STAR TREK fans - if you had any logic and balls - youd be demonstrating for Berman's removal from this franchise instead of trying to save ENTERPRISE.
You keep paramounts feet to the fire by withholding money not raising it, you morons.
Save Trek by removing this turd.
Quote:
"We pitched this to Shatner and there was a long silence," Coto continued.
Yeah, if I was Shatner I wouldn't know what to say either.
"You want me to do what?"
*sigh*
Too bad we didn't get the Reeves-Stevens idea though. That woulda been friggin' sweet.
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You know, I've never had a problem with Brannon Braga, I've always been impressed with his work on Voyager (Especially season 5). But Berman on the other hand... This 'chef' idea is the epitomy of stupidity, seriously. I couldn't read the idea without laughing and can not comprehend how Berman could himself not see this idea as ridiculous. From what I can gather, he's the reason Kirk didn't come back..not Shatner himself.
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Yes I am Australian...AND NO I DO NOT OWN A KANGAROO! And it's typical that we were made the last ones to join the federation....
That would've made a good episode. However, Berman's idea sounded like a bad sitcom plot. I could see them using Shatner in two roles, both as Tiberius and as Chef. Obviously, play the Tiberius bit, then at the end, get a shot of Chef, who just happens to look like Tiberius (and likely is an ancestor). How is it that Berman has reverted to such trivial plots? I could've come up with a plot like that, and I have little creativity. It's a shame that B&B weren't let go of at the beginning of the series, and instead have Coto as the producer and the Reeves-Stevens as the primary writers. The stuff they have put forward so far has been good, makes me reminiscent of some of their books, very well written, surprising twists, and excellent continuity. And now, their full potential will be stuck solely in novels in the future.
I always had mixed feelings about Shanter appearing. I am glad that we are seeing "Through a Mirror, Darkly" instead of either really.
Honestly though I think Mike Sussman's idea was the stronger of the two. Mirror Universe Kirk just seems to contrived in itself. For something that was the build up to be "The Return of Kirk". Can you imagine that being easily explained to the casual Star Trek fans they were hoping to attract or advertised in clear way? I can't. Maybe it is just because Mike Sussman is my favorite Enterprise writer but his idea seemed to have more potential. "Important Ceremony"? Mike if you happen to see this was it going to be the launching of the Enterprise-B? Meaning that it was actually Chef who really died in Kirk's place. Or am I way off?
I am sorry, but after reading this, I must say, it's really no wonder. Kirk, one of the greatest pop icon heroes in American history, turns out to be the descendant of the chef on Rick and Brannon's Enterprise? No wonder Shatner wanted nothing to do with it. **shaking head**
It's funny also that almost every one of the "big, event" STAR TREK stories in the last 5 years were pretty much written in the BBSes. Both the mirror idea and the notion of him playing Chef were on the Internet for years. The entire premise of ENT was pretty much predicted years before it was revealed.
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It's a rip-off. / We're stepped on, and cheated! / We're flat, stone-cold lied to / But we're not defeated / No!
Halen. "The Dream is Over."
The Following is just a Conspiracy Theory, nothing more:
For the longest time, I have said that Shatner should play Chef as Kirk's ancestor. I've basically been the only one who has said more than once. If it is true that the ST staff reads these forums and have adopted some of my ideas, then someone at Star Trek read my idea of Shatner as Chef, Berman got wind of it and the rest is history.
Damn it! My ideas are meant to do good in the world of Trek, not evil!
End of Conspiracy Theory
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Quote:
"We pitched this to Shatner and there was a long silence," Coto continued. After that, the studio negotiations with Shatner fell through
So, first Kirk was killed on the big screen in a miserably antiheroic way, and then B&B+C tell Shatner that Kirk "got into trouble, got taken out of history" in the Berman Trek timeline, thus a busboy ancestor must save the day in what sounds like a Jerry Lewis skit.
Brilliant. 
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Farewell Comments from the ENT Cast
Quote:"but Berman pitched an alternative concept, which was actually devised by writer Mike Sussman.
"Shatner was going to be 'Chef' - an ancestor of Kirk." Sussman explained "We would find out that at some point in the future the real Kirk got into trouble, got taken out of history. And Daniels would show up, he would grab Archer, he would grab Chef - who of course looked like a William Shatner - and say, 'You have to go to the future and impersonate Captain Kirk in some important ceremony.' That was the setup."
WHAT A STUPID IDEA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
This has got to be a real BAD joke!!!
Quote:"We pitched this to Shatner and there was a long silence," Coto continued. After that, the studio negotiations with Shatner fell through, but they still wanted to do a Mirror Universe episode, which became the two parter "In a Mirror, Darkly
Well NO kidding Shatner didn't respond back. He GIVES them a great idea and they in turn reject it for some LAMEASS idea! Shatner must be thinking "What kind of idiots are running Trek"!
As far as I am concerned Shatners books are canon!
STXI: A trainwreck waiting to happen!
Berman/Sussman's idea... is that a joke? That's the stupidest idea I've ever heard. And right now, I really can't think of anything dumber. Even Threshold sounds better.
Shatner, who is as popular as he has EVER been, WANTS to do Enterprise, and comes up with his OWN idea, and Berman gives him some Chef/TCW SHIT? He must be fired NOW!
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No! Only the eyes of a chief may see the Ie Plebniesta!
"Oh, Kirk's Return Would Have Been Marvelous!"
"Oh, Kirk Coming Back Would Have Brought BACK Tons Of Fans!"
"It Would Be The Best ENT EVER!"
Okay folks, I have been ENTERRPRISE's biggest supporter and defender. Yet, as you can see here, every now and then I do know when crap is crap.
AND THIS IS SHIT!
All I heard was more and more and more reasons why Shatner should return. Why he should reprise his role as Captain Kirk.
This would have been the ultimate fuck-job to continuity. The Terran Empire was not humane in anyway. To say that they invented, or at least owned, technology that would have been humane to prisoners and threats is ridiculous.
Come on, yea, the Tiberius episode would have been fun. I love the Mirror Universe novels that the Stevens wrote. YET, this is cheesy, Archer and Tiberius were the reason for it's existence! You've got to be kidding me!
I am so glad that this upcoming "In A Mirror, Darkly" episode will be a stand alone and not feature a "crossover".
This will be enjoyable and entertaining. I cringe for the finale and feel that "Terra Prime" will most likely be the TRUE finale in my eyes. I will watch "These Are The Voyages" for the entertainment value but not enjoy Riker and Troi. If the primary story of Archer and his crew is any good, then I will probably enjoy it.
But common, I had more faith in the Stevens (AND SHATNER) than this! OH MY GOD I'M GONNA BE SICK!
But I will be truthful, I actually like the Berman storyline. It would have been interesting. But I would have modified it more. I would have Daniels show up to Kirk's timeline. Possibly a few months before the ENTERPRISE-B's launch and have Kirk look at him and say "You!", you know, give off some freelance idea that would never be explored but just guessed at, that Daniels and Kirk had met before and had experienced the same shit Archer went through.
Anyways, I would have Daniels tell Kirk that someone from his past (could be anyone, we could go down the line of all the people who hate Kirk) has joined the ranks of the Temporal Cold War and went to help [insert villanous species of Federation] and Kirk was the only one to help. In the end, Daniels, Kirk and Archer stop this guy and Kirk is returned back to his home before Ent-B launch.
But I'm not television writer, so it would have probably sucked too...but, all in all, I love the overall concept of Berman's story, it just needs to be modified somewhat.
Anyways, shows that Shatner is really not the author of the Shatnerverse novels, but the Stevens are...
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I guess all I have to say is... leave it to Rick Berman to kill a good idea....(?)
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