Will wonders never cease? It's simply astonishing. I just don't see where they are getting the impression that there's a market for more Trek. After the ratings continue to slide for Enterprise and the dismal failure of the last two films, I just don't understand why they're doing this.
Except that Paramount is starting to really slip when it comes to their feature films. They haven't had a film make over 200 million dollars since M:I-2 and I think they're desperate for a working franchise. Most of their attempts at summer blockbusters recently have been laughable, especially when compared with what Fox, Warner Bros., New Line and Universal have been putting out lately. Since the Tomb Raider films have gone nowhere, they want something and since Trek is still around in some form or another, they think they'll eventually get it right sometime.
As for the story itself, I think it's something that I'd personally be interested in. I'd prefer that they more or less ditch what thrown together history they have for the Romulan Wars, but since the introduction of the never-before-heard-of Remans, I'm sure they'd be fighting them face-to-face instead of the Romulans to keep that little tidbit in line with previously established information. I don't know if they're going to try and do some LOTR trilogy about the war and the eventual founding of the UFP, but it's possible that could be some inspiration.
I have felt for some time now that an original film-only crew might be the way to go, especially if they could net some character actors that don't demand much in the way of pay, perhaps get one fairly well-known actor as the lead and you might create enough curiosity there that it could turn into a modest hit.
I wish them luck, but darn it all if I just don't see their mindset when it comes to this.
The "franchise" is in the waning stages of an insurmountable illness.
But in all seriousness, let us take a step back from our obsession. Star Trek is a phenomenon that has far outlived is usefullness and resourcefullness. The latter is perhaps the most relevant object of this post.
Where exactly can they go now? Star Trek is dead on so many levels it defies reason that it continues to trudge onward. Let us look objectively at the present state of "Trekdom" (whatever the hell that is exactly).
Apparently, the idea of an eleventh Star Trek feature film is not a myth. After the combined events that lead to Star Trek: Nemesis being the fiasco that it was, I am somewhat surprised to find that an eleventh movie is under consideration so soon. I say somewhat surprised as this is the same outfit (Paramount) that decided releasing Nemesis a week before a Harry Potter film was sound judgement. It doesn't really get any more obvious that those in charge of this franchise are so out of touch with reality that reality just can seep in, even though the dam has burst into a million shards.
Of course, the eleventh film has to be about something "Star Trek" ... well, maybe not, but it might be a good idea. Let us look at the options, as they were.
ST: TNG. Raking in the lowest domestic box office in the history of Star Trek does not make the TNG crew a viable option. Whatever the excuse for the debacle, business accumen warrants that something about TNG is broken and must be avoided. Sorry folks, but I wouldn't touch TNG with a ten foot pole at this point. Financial investment is the issue here.
ST: DS9. Still for some reason, the bastard child of the Trek Universe, this property is the least likely of all to be made into a feature film. "Just not fan friendly." "Too obscure." "Too dark." "Not Star Trek-y enough". These are just a few of the catch phrases which mire this edition of Star Trek at the bottom of the barrel. The love it or hate it stigma of this series makes it a no-go. That and the almost total abandonment by Berman mean no film. But besides that, what exactly would it be about? The wormhole again? The Dominion? Would it have to take place at DS9 even? Perhaps not, but then ... it wouldn't be DS9 would it?
ST: Voyager. Uh, what would this be about again? The crew has returned home. Its crew no doubt scattered to the four corners of the universe. Remember, some of the most interesting cast weren't even StarFleet officers, so how would we work them into a script? 7o9 isn't a commissioned officer. The EMH is just a hologram (and a dated one now). Half the remaining cast are Maquis refugees, and whats left isn't that interesting. What exactly could the movie revolve around? I'm sure you could fabricate something, but it would be stretching the space-time fabric well past its tolerances ... if it hasn't been already.
ST: Enterprise. Well, frankly, despite what anyones personal feelings about this series are, its irrelevant. This show is on life-support in the worst way, and doesn't even begin to deserve a feature film. The cast outside of Bakula are unknowns. The show hasn't garnered much attention even among Star Trek faithful. And its so poorly concieved that anything that resulted would be a bizarre mish-mash of amalgamated Star Trek, regurgitated into a mess of non-descript blandness as they try to play it safe. No thank you ... I didn't like it on TV, I'm certainly not going to pay to go see it in a theater.
ST: TOS, Captain Sulu Time-line. While this may have been feasible at one time, I think the idea is past its prime. I don't doubt George Takei's ability to put on a costume, but I do question his viability at this stage in his career. They've neglected the Sulu character for so long that I doubt tossing him into a feature film and watching it drown in disinterest is going to be what it takes to jump start a dead horse. How can you realistically expect to start a new franchise with an actor who's in the stratosphere of his life expectancy?
ST: TOS, Captain Kirk rides again. C'mon people. Everybody loves Kirk, but we have to just let it go. They killed him already for cryin' out loud.
So guess what? They've painted themselves into a corner. A great many things have had to go wrong in order for them to get to the point we've reached. The only thing they could reasonably concoct would be a "new" cast and crew and set it somewhere between Enterprise and TOS. The only "canon" idea left that hasn't been thoroughly raped and pillaged is the Romulan Wars. So ... why not! With glee and raucous abandon, this is the best they can come up with. Are you surprised? I'm not.
The problem with basing a movie around this idea has been stated by others, but I will recap the most obvious and illuminating: According to lore, the Romulan Wars were fought with interstellar missiles and without either side confronting the other. Well, shucks, that sounds about as exciting as watching paint dry. So obviously that'll have to be convienently forgotten about during the initial draft ... which will alienate the faithful ... who'll just happen to be the only people who care enough at this point. Combine this with a completely new cast of possibly unknown talent (and I use the term hopefully) and you have a recipie for utter disaster which threatens to make Nemesis look like a blockbuster by financial comparison.
The problem may have been created by Rick Berman and Brannon Braga's indiffrence to the writing on the wall the last several years, but the truth is the problem is much bigger than the two of them times ten. This franchise has been ground into the maelstrom that is incest and greed for so long that I fear nothing can pull it beyond the black-hole-like grip of death. We're circling the drain. We're preparing for the dirt-nap. Whatever cute phrase you can come up with, I fear it is befiting of being transmutted into axiom status.
Lack of vision brought us to where we are. A collision with reality will make us finally move on to something else.
BTW, using Romulans as villans in any abortive eleventh movie will be a first, not a second. The Picard clone and Reman insurgents were the villains in Nemesis ... not the Romulans. Small detail ... :)
Peace
...I will never watch another episode of first-run Trek. Period. Until Paramount/Viacom come to their senses and understand this, they have permanently lost someone who used to consider TNG and DS9 appointment television.
And I sure as hell won't be shelling out any more money to watch BermanTrek at my local multiplex. Another prequel with characters nobody has ever heard of before? The Romulan Wars? Only hard-core Trek nuts who have memorized every line of dialog from Balance of Terror will know what the hell it is. Expect an opening weekend box office of about $1 million. Not to mention it will have to be hamstringed by Roddenberry's incredibly wacked idea that the war occurred without humans ever actually seeing a Romulan! NEWSFLASH! This was STU-PID! Not everything in TOS was a good idea! But you can bet that if they try to get around this very dumb obstacle, Trek Zombies will howl in protest that "canon" is being violated, just like they did when the Ferengi showed up on Enterprise.
This isn't like Star Wars, where Lucas is king and totally in charge and answers to nobody. He has destroyed his franchise with 1 mediocre and 1 incredibly shitty movie and nobody can do anything about it.
Berman, OTOH, doesn't own Trek, and theoretically has to answer to the Paramount/Viacom bigwigs. It is incomprehensible to me that he and Braga are still in charge of Trek.
I apologize if this subject has been brought up in one of the other 137 posts, but I have a question: why is everyone so convinced that this prequel film is being developed by B&B? Yes, Berman has said that he is "involved" in the film's development (I think he said something like "deeply involved"), but there's been no mention of Braga's involvement that I'm aware of. In fact, Braga says "there is a prequel feature in development," not "we're developing a prequel feature."
Ordinarily this might seem like wishful thinking, but the AICN post back in March that originally broke this story (here) clearly stated that B&B are NOT developing the movie -- that instead, Jordan Kerner (of...ugh..."Snow Dogs" fame) is in charge.
In light of this, and the lack of specifics in B&B's comments, I really wonder if they're involved much at all. It could very well be that Paramount is giving the prequel movie to an entirely different team, and that Berman is being consulted in the development (possibly only to avoid continuity conflicts), but without any real power. We all know his tendency to overstate things in interviews; maybe this is another example? Or is there other evidence of B&B's involvement that I'm unaware of?
If true, I'm cautiously optimistic, not because I think that the "Snow Dogs" guy is the most obvious choice, but because there's the possibility that we might actually see some non-Berman Trek for the first time in 13 years.
Cranston
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Never before have things been so much the way they are now.
A stand alone Star Trek feature film just won't work at the box office and Paramount execs will probably ask the million dollar question: If fans have such little interest in Enterprise why would they go to see a film that will have no connection to any of the other series? Sure, Star Trek fans know all about the Romulan Wars but will a mainstream audience care? Will a film without any of Star Trek's established characters have any chance at success?
As a movie of the week on UPN it could probably pull a decent number but only Star Trek fans would flock to theaters to see a film about the Romulan Wars (and after NEMESIS there's no guarantee of that happening either). If they're hoping to expand Star Trek's core audience this isn't the way to do it.
Everyone take a deep breath. Paramount will very likely reject the story and tell B&B to go back and come up with something else for an 11th feature.
This movie isn't going to happen, folks.
After reading this little interview I'm pretty excited that all those people who have wanted something with the Romulan wars, will actually get it! This ought to be the best news for a long time. The keepers of the Star Trek franchine have obviously listened to you. There are going to be a movie with exactly the concept you wanted all along.
For those who seem to be unhappy, well, what can I say... Some people will be unhappy no matter what is decided. If you belong to the unlucky category this time around, please consider to take a deep breath and get over it. Just like I got over some dissapointments in the past. It's not that difficult, and not even worth mentioning so I'll skip talking about that.
The encouraging part here, is how B&B are doing an effort to keep Star Trek on course, meaning 2 things: Balance the wishes of the fans, with the parameters of Roddenberry's vision. Sometimes these two things seem to contradict. Actually there is no perfect solution to it, when we go into detail. But when we see the big picture, it's encouraging that B&B are TRYING (which is more than most producers would do, and B&B are better suited because they have worked personally with Gene) well they are TRYING, and those fans who are loudest on the Internet get the attention they want.
All in all, this project sounds promising. Of course, there is no guarantees of success; it's showbusiness and it's plain business and the world is not a safe place. But, along with Braga's notes about ending the TCW, it's more obvious than ever, they listen to you! Now I sincerely hope you're return their friendly gesture and give them a bit of praise. :-)
It seems evident that most people have no interest in prequel Trek, just like myself. I don't watch ENT. Its just not that interesting. The romulan war/Birth of the Federation would probably work as 2 seperate movies. But I would prefer seeing that on TV, not in theaters. I have always thought that Trek would do very well with made for TV movies and specials. Trek just doesnt have any staying power at the box office.
We all used to enjoy going to the theaters not just to see a Trek movie, but to see our favorite characters. But when these guys who run the franchise give you a movie with little substance, its hard to justify spending the money to see it.
Its kinda funny too, but the most recent successful box office Treks are the ones that used Lucas ILM effects. The ones that didn't use ILM (Final Frontier, Insurrection, Nemesis)werent the best films money wise. I wonder if they will catch on to this.
WHAT THE FUCK IS WRONG WITH YOU PEOPLE!?
I really hate Star Trek fans at the moment, I mean we've wanted to see the Romulan Wars on screen now for god knows how long. Now they are fucking doing it and you guys are still bitching and moaning. Did I miss something at the last "Hate Star Trek Club" meeting!? What is it you want now, do you suddenly want aimless space wanderings again where the characters don't grow or change!? Argh!
Sorry, I'm bitter, I really want this movie to go on and do well, I want to see the Romulan Wars, mostly I want the fans to care again!
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"I can't think of one right now, please check and try again."
I hear George Lucas will be available to direct soon. He's proven he can do just as good as B&B at driving sci-fi franchises into the ground. Better yet, he's proven he can do it in just 3 prequels, just what Paramount ordered.
I really wish I had some optimism about Trek. I really do. There just doesn't seem to be anything bright on the horizon.
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"Dammit, I'm a doctor, not a... oh, yeah, right..."
--Phil Hartman as McCoy, Saturday Night Live
Alls I know is that for the second movie in a row they won't be getting any money from me at the box office. I'll catch it when it's on Netflix or HBO.
Trek is not going to survive much longer if these two will have their way. I always thought there was a god somewhere.......
...I'm sorry, but nowhere, ANYWHERE does it say that Enterprise is around when the Federation is founded. Archer is involved with it, we do know that, and we've been told that ENT will be involved with events leading up to the foundation of the Federation, but not actually involved in the foundation itself. I also point out that in Zero Hour, Daniels shows Archer a point in history that he identifies as the founding of the Federation, and said that it was something like 8 or 12 years in the future. Clearly, if ENT only has 1 to 4 seasons left, that would mean that there is no way they can show us the actual Federation founding. That would even leave enough time to have the series end in 1 to 4 years, have a 4 to 8 year window for the Romulan Wars to occur, and then have the Federation come into being as Daniels showed in his "time jump" thingy.
I admit, I was kind of hoping to see some Rommie Wars in ENT, but I'm sorry guys and gals, I find it very hard to consider any of this bad (or non-cannon) news.
-Lem
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"The Andorian Mining Consortium runs from no one!" -Shran (ENT "Proving Ground")
"Oh no, the Pawnee have returned. I suppose they'll want their souls back." - C. M. Burns
I think in some ways a Romulan War storyline would work best on the big screen with a sufficient budget to do it justice.
Of course I have a few qualifications on that statement.
Firstly telling a story like the Romulan War in one movie which uses unfamiliar characters and settings would be foolish. It needs to be told as a trilogy in order to give the story the proper amount of time it needs to develop.
Why not tell the story on the small screen? Two reasons. The budget would severely limit the scale of the stories that are being told with a lot of the larger scale stuff having to happen off screen. Also as is often the case on television the Romulan Wars would become an arc that dragged on and on with no real resolution in order to keep viewers coming back to see what happens next in the storyline and when the story finally was resolved people would have given up caring which was pretty much my experience with the Xindi arc not to mention the Temporal Cold War storyline.
So how would I plot out the trilogy? I think the first movie would open with scenes of a Romulan invasion and conquest of an alien world with troops landing, blasting cities into rubble and rounding up survivors.
Then the movie would switch to a council chamber on Vulcan where the leaders of the Vulcan race would discuss the Romulan Empire's expansion and how it is encroaching on Vulcan territory. That hostilities between the Vulcans and the Andorians are severely crippling the Vulcan's ability to defend their borders against the Romulan incursions of their territory. After some discussion the council reaches the decision that a treaty must be forged between the Vulcans and the Andorians at all costs. Further discussion leads to the conclusion that the treaty talks must be held on neutral territory and it is eventually decided to contact Earth and request the assistance of humanity in the treaty talks.
Starfleet dispatches a ship - the Pegasus - to Vulcan and Andoria to collect their respective Ambassadorial parties and convey them to Earth where the talks will be held.
On the return trip to Earth the Vulcan Ambassador is murdered - the identity of the killer unknown. Unable to determine the identity of the murderer the Pegasus' captain is forced to let the matter slide for the time being and decides to continue to Earth after speaking with the Vulcan Ambassador's second in command who is now in charge of the Vulcan delegation.
Nearing Earth the Pegasus encounters an alien vessel requesting to dock. Once docked the captain meets an alien (not Romulan) that claims to be a representative of the Romulan Star Empire and requests to be involved in the treaty talks as an Ambassador of the Romulan Empire. The Vulcan ambassador does not like the idea but the Andorian ambassador is extremely interested in what the Romulans have to say and insists that the Romulan representative be allowed to remain. Although reluctant the captain agrees to allow the alien to remain on board as a diplomatic representative of the Romulan Empire. That decided the Pegasus proceeds to Earth and the treaty talks begin.
Up until now the Romulan incursions have only been against Vulcan territory and the Andorians ask why they should be interested in Vulcan concerns. The Vulcan Ambassador suggests that once the Vulcans fall the Andorians will be next. The Romulan representative interjects stating that his people have no interest in Andorian held territory and that the Vulcan systems they have taken are merely the Romulans reclaiming systems that were always theirs and that it is in fact the Vulcans who were intruding on Romulan territory. The Romulan representative presents documents to back his claim. The discussions continue in this vein with the Vulcans attempting to convince the Andorians that a cease fire and perhaps even an alliance against the Romulan Empire would be in both their best interests with the Andorian Ambassador seemingly apathetic to the Vulcan's claims and the Romulan representative trying to persuade the Andorians that the Romulans have no hostile intentions towards them.
While the talks continue the Captain of the Pegasus remains as an observer of the proceedings although a human Ambassador oversees them. Meanwhile the senior officers of the Pegasus continue to investigate the murder of the original Vulcan Ambassador and come to a shocking conclusion as to the killer's identity.
Just prior to the discovery of the identity of the killer the talks have broken down and the Andorians have retreated to the building assigned to them. The human Ambassador having left not long afterwards to try and persuade them back to the table. Shortly after that the Vulcan delegation returns to their own building and the Captain of the Pegasus is left alone with the Romulan representative. After an awkward silence the Captain offers to escort the Romulan rep back to his quarters and they leave together. AS they are making their way to the Romulan rep's quarters a violent shaking and loud boom rock around them as the building where the Andorians are housed goes up in flames wiping out the entire party.
After this events rapidly come to a head as the identity of the murderer of the original Vulcan Ambassador and the individual responsible for the destruction of the Andorian party is revealed to be the current Vulcan Ambassador - actually a Romulan, although no-one realises this since at that time it was unknown what Romulan's looked like. The murderer is apprehended and believed to be Vulcan. The Andorian government on hearing the news immediately withdraws completely from the talks and even contacts the Romulans offering them an alliance against the Vulcans and humans - who they blame for failing to protect their representatives. The Romulans accept and an alliance is formed against which neither the Vulcan nor the human forces combined can stand.
The movie ends with a combined Romulan and Andorian fleet attacking a distant human colony world.
That's how I see movie one in a Romulan War trilogy ending - with a cliffhanger. Movie two would involve a series of desperate battles between the opposing forces with the Vulcans and humans steadily retreating and a side-plot involving the Pegasus and crew attempting to find a way to drive a wedge between the Romulans and the Andorians. Eventually they discover evidence that the Vulcan Ambassador was not a Vulcan but in fact a Romulan agent that had undergone cosmetic surgery in order to appear Vulcan. It turns out the Vulcan Ambassador wasn't even a Romulan merely a member of one of their many conquered species. This evidence causes some of the Andorian leadership to have doubts about their alliance but not sufficiently so to end it. The war continues with the Vulcans and humans steadily losing world after world to the encroaching forces.
Meanwhile an Andorian General - Sh'ran - leads combined Romulan/Andorian assaults on human colony worlds. On the tenth captured world Sh'ran visits a Romulan prison camp and is sickened by the brutal treatment of the human prisoners and is shocked to discover gas chambers where the majority of prisoners including men, women and children are being executed. At first he convinces himself that this is an isolated incident but driven by conscience he investigates further and is horrified to discover that it is standard practice. Upon learning this he retreats to his ship and makes a beeline home to Andoria where he presents the facts to his leaders who berate him for leaving his post and dismiss the facts out of hand, having Sh'ran imprisoned for desertion. Disgusted by his leaders Sh'ran is rescued from his prison by loyal members of his crew and once back on board his ship he decides that his leaders are corrupt and must be overthrown. He gathers an army of followers and a fleet of ships with captains equally disgusted by the Romulan atrocities around him and leads an assault on his home world's capital. After a climactic battle Sh'ran captures and imprisons his world's former leaders and makes public the true facts of the war. Shock spreads all over the world and throughout the Andorian territories at the news of the Romulan atrocities which the Andorian government had been suppressing. With overwhelming public opinion on Sh'ran's side the rest of the Andorian military forces comes over to his side and he leads a massive Andorian fleet to the site of the current battle between the Vulcan/Human and Romulan forces. The Andorian fleet takes the Romulan fleet by surprise and smashes them apart from behind leaving the Vulcans and Humans to mop up the left overs. The battle over Sh'ran contacts the Vulcan and Human generals and proposes an alliance to end the Romulan threat once and for all. End movie two.
Movie three would be fairly obvious I would think. We've had the buildup and this is the climax. Where the great alliances that sow the seeds of Federation are formed and the largest battles to date are fought as the Allies recapture territory after territory. Until finally two thirds of the way through the movie the war ends and the Romulans withdraw to their old territories to lick their wounds. The humans, Vulcans and Andorians are too weakened to pursue and rather return home in triumph. The war is over but the cleaning up has just begun. Many billions of lives were extinguished and buildings and cities destroyed. There is much rebuilding to be done and alliances to be forged. Muc later we see for the first time a flag raised above a memorial of those who died in the war Andorian, Vulcan and human. A flag that will one day become the standard of the United Federation of Planets but for now represents the welding together of three races whose alliance has been forged with the blood of those who died in battle.
What do you think?
What I absolutely do not comprehend about the BBrain Trust is why they don't make some Trek TV movies. The movie franchise only got started based on the demand for TOS. There has been nowhere near that level of demand in recent years.
So why not make a few TV movies every year? They could do one-shots like a DS9 or VOY followup. They could also do other stuff like this new prequel idea, and a "Captain Sulu" story. They could introduce entirely new characters, and then spin off related book series and merchandise. And they coould probably make these movies for the cost of an ep (give or take).
These could be promoted for cheap on UPN or wherever, and even get some free publicity from TV Guide, ET and media sources, since such a movie would be a "TV event." So they'd save all the money spent on cinematic advertising and promotion.
With Trek currently on life support, the time has come for the BBrain Trust to consider making Trek TV movies.
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GET A LIFE, will you people? I mean, for crying out loud, it's just a TV show!.... You've turned an enjoyable little job, that I did as a lark for a few years, into a COLOSSAL WASTE OF TIME! -- William Shatner on Saturday Night Live (1986)
Berman & Braga must have sold more than their souls to the devil in order to keep their jobs this long. Nothing else explains Paramount/Viacom's continued refusal to throw these hacks out on their asses and bring in new leadership.
YIKES!!!! YIKES!!!!!YIKES!!!!! YIKES!!!! YIKES!!!!! YIKES!!!!
They thought 'Nemesis' did poorly at the box office.
Just wait until the final numbers come in on this.
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"Blackbird singing in the dead of night, take these broken wings and learn to fly. All you life, you were only waiting for this moment to arise."
-John Lennon/Paul McCartney
I think it could work for a couple of reasons.
First with no big name actors the film budget will be lower than Nemesis so it may actually turn a profit.
Second being a Trek movie, many fans will go see it out of curiousity at least. Exactly how many is something they are going to have to gamble on.
Third if they put it out when no other big movies like LoTR are playing, casual movie goers may just check it out. My freinds( non trek fans) and I were desparate for a movie worth seeing from Feb-March and certainly would have seen this movie if it was out.
But I also think it sucks because as of now it appears as if Berman is heavily involved. Plus I wanted the Romulan wars to be featured in ENT. Also they clearly need to wait several years for people to forget Nemesis.
But I'm just really not interested in this idea, TNG'S 5th movie would suit me just fine - its what I want to see - Nemesis wasn't a good enough farewell, and Riker's departure leaves more stories to tell.
The beauty of Star Trek is that rich character background you love and know when you sit down to watch a movie. From the way the films have been going (i.e. little focus on characters and more action) I don't see how a totally new cast could be padded out enough during the length of a movie - perhaps they'll managed to pull off a Lord of the Rings or an X-Men (great stories, excellent action, but also amazing character development) - but I doubt it.
Maybe I'm just that second wave of nostalgic fans, as TOSers were with TNG, I am with whats to come - one thing is certain, the prequel series hasn't really worked, so why should the movie?!
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Nemesis had all the right buttons there waiting to be pressed, but like Data on a Reman keypad Paramount seem to have pushed the wrong ones. :/
Once again Trek fan finds an excuse to bitch and moan
First you wanted the Romulan Wars, now that they are thinking of throwing that in to a movie, you complain.
Which is it with you people? Either you want something or you don't.
This has to be the first good news I've heard about STXI.
This is a big mistake, Paramount. Why go with a prequel when the current prequel series has low ratings? Why not use the existing cast of RECOGNIZABLE - and famous (Patrick Stewart) - characters?
Furthermore, in ENT's timeline, the Romulan Wars should be occuring soon. So how will you have a movie that takes place the same time as the series? And if the series is about the formation of the Federation (as stated by B&B, and as foreshadowed by Ent's ZERO HOUR) then how can you show the formation of the Federation and skip over the Romulan Wars?
It really is mind boggling. I just don't see any way of doing the Romulan Wars without showing the ENT cast. After all, there is only one NX class ship, and Archer is the captain.
Moreover, how can you fight a war with the Romulans without any advanced ships to wage that war?
The Romulans failed as villains in NEMESIS. Why use them again?
Let's see another TNG movie. By then ENT will be over and the Romulan Wars can begin. Berman is jumping the gun on this one ...
... and perhaps "Jumping the Shark" as well.
Timmer33
After STV everyone was saying that Star Trek films were finished. They turned around and did STVI. A great movie.
So why is TNG getting treated like they have cancer or something? They could still do a good movie with the TNG cast by getting someone who is not incompetent as Berman and Braga to write the film.
Getting rid of the TNG is a BIG mistake. Why don't they get another chance at a movie like the original cast did. Why let TNG go out on a bad note?
Recasting an entire cast for this "Star Wars: Battle Of Geonosis" is a huge MISTAKE.
Why Paramount is going to bankroll this movie with no established cast is suicide!
Flood Braga's website and tell him to get off the crack pipe!
Assuming this is all legit (I'd be surprised if it isn't), I am cautiously optimistic. The idea does present various complications, such as the fact that the RW are supposed to occur in ENT's timeframe, but yet the movie isn't going to be about the ENT crew. So does mean ENT will end next spring as a lead-in to the RW? But if that's the case, then how could ENT found the Federation, since the Federation is supposed to be founded as a result of the RW?
Lots of questions, but that doesn't mean they aren't going to be answered satisfactorily. Although I find it a little strange that after 4 years of ENT, which has not been enormously successful to say the least, they would essentially "try again" with the exact same idea: a prequel with a new cast/crew. Only difference is this time instead of the TCW, it's the Romulan Wars. From a business standpoint, it would almost seem like they'd rather go as far from ENT as possible for the next new ST production rather than essentially do the same idea over again on a bigger scale.
That said, I am intrigued by the idea of an all-new cast of characters. I think that has always been a good idea for the movie franchise. Since they undoubtably will want new costumes, ships, etc etc. it seems weird that they would choose an era that is supposed to be the same as ENT, so it'll be interesting to see how this pans out.
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It's a rip-off. / We're stepped on, and cheated! / We're flat, stone-cold lied to / But we're not defeated / No!
Halen. "The Dream is Over."
First of all, I like almost all things Trek. I'm one of those saps who'll see anything once if it has the Trek name on it.
HOWEVER, I have to agree with the B&B detractors on this one (and that's tough for me to do). This smacks of desperation on the part of Berman. It pretty much violates the tenant of all movie sequels: you've got to have familiar faces/relationships so that there's something to build on. This whole Romulan Wars thing escapes me.
I'm sure after the last 2 Trek movies, the gatekeepers at Paramount don't want another TNG movie. But frankly, B&B do need to be put out to pasture. Insurrection and Nemesis were good stories ... for a one-hour TV episode. Other than First Contact, B&B have not shown me they've got the teeth or the vision or whatever for feature film work. Compare the last two films to Spider-Man 2 and you see what's missing is the relationship dynamic. S2 works because of all the little moments between the characters -- not the action sequences. That's what B&B don't get about feature films. The bigger the scope, the more finely tuned your dialogue and character interaction has to be.
I'm done.
First, Scorned is THE MAN!!! His views are similar to mine and he's right on target.
1. The Romulan Wars should not be done in just a single movie. This is an event in Trek history that is equal to Star Wars' Clone wars in importance. If it's going to be done in films -- plot out three films and do them justice. But asking these writers to PLAN a trilogy is like asking a monkey to pilot a space shuttle.
2. Enterprise at least would allow enough time to give the event the proper amount of time due for storytelling.
3. The Romulans themselves are NOT a problem with regard to lack of interest by the fans (it's NOT that nobody wants to see the Romulans -- they are one of the least used races in Trek). Just like any other villain good writing is required to maintain interest. Saying "nobody wants to see the Romulans" is a copout...
4. Fire Berman and Braga! They are just not equipped for the challenge of fixing Enterprise and DEFINITELY should not be in charge of another movie (that will just be another bomb -- probably WORSE than Nemesis as people still remember how bad Insurrection and Nemesis were). Berman has accomplished something Harve Bennett never did -- two back to back flop films. Overcoming that is going to be a MONUMENTAL chore. Plus, if the prequel gets made it will NOT have the advantage of ANY of the casts we have come to know. An unknown cast will NOT work to the advantage of the next film given that it has to overcome the bad taste/memories of Insurrection and Nemesis.
The next film -- even if by a miracle it's great -- will have the odds stacked against it. And if Paramount decides to make it anyway and it bombs there goes the opportunity to do a trilogy. The baby will die in the womb. So, then we'd NEVER get to see the Romulan Wars done as they need to be.
5. The Eugenics War. Look, dumbasses...go back and watch Space Seed (I know, asking you to actually WATCH a TOS episode is beneath you)! It is STATED that the Eugenics War took place in the 1990's. Even though we know in real time no Eugenics War took place, we need to respect the established Trek timeline and enforce continuity. There's no way in hell you can set the Eugenics War in Archer's time.
Maroons.
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Quack!!!
Are they serious that Enterprise may not feature the Romulan Wars? This was one of the only aspects of Enterprise that always had potential.
Please tell me that Enterprise gets destroyed and that's why they can't participate in the Romulan Wars. If the producers do stick to canon and have the Wars in 2156, then Enterprise should be involved unless they are destroyed.
Don't ruin this major event in Trek history, by overlooking it on Enterprise.
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"Mr. Spock, the women on your planet are logical. That's the only planet in the galaxy that can make that claim." -- Kirk
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"Live long and prosper, Spock." -- T'Pau
"I shall do neither. I have killed my captain, and my friend." -- Spock
please RIGHT CLICK and select SAVE TARGET AS:
http://fongunlimited.com/media/gene.mov
and start finding mirrors for it. I'm benchmarking my bandwidth but if it runs out (due to popularity) then surely some of you fans must back it up. It belongs to the lore of Internet vaults.
So... why am I posting this? It is to remind both the fans, the creators and anyone out there who claims to be a Trekkie at heart what the true meaning of Star Trek is. Who better to state it then the creator of Star Trek himself. Without him we wouldn't be here posting messages... it'll probably be somn else like babylon5...
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"LET THEM DIE!!!"
No Romulan war to feature in Enterprise as it is comming up in a few years. So what I'm asking why don't they have the Romulan Wars in Enterprise and base a movie on something else (or tell the story from the Romulan point of view), though I'm surprised they are allowed near a Star Trek film after what happened with the last one.
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19/06/03 1 Year Here!!
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Faxanadu: You're a lier.
Mr. Xindi: I tend not to lie as I'm not good at it.
From this teeny-tiny bit of info, I am FOR this project going forward. At this point, having characters unrelated to TV is a natural progression for the franchise. The current TV series (DS9, VOY, ENT) haven't been watched by enough people to make them viably marketable. Sure, they could TRY to do a DS9 movie, but why take the risk?
The major downside is trying to live down two flops in a row. The general reaction will probably be, "They're making another Star Trek movie?"
Still, I say go for a new flick with new characters to get people interested in Trek again.
Now, all of that said, I believe it is a HUGE mistake for B&B to do this:
1) They are STILL burnt-out. These guys need some serious beach-time before they do anything else.
2) They've already totally botched their first prequel concept.
3) It was CLEARLY stated beyond ANY doubt that the Romulan Wars were fought with primitive nuclear weapons. Unless they go against ENT, this film will likely put craters into continuity (not that most people will care.)
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Shiny!
RE: Ok
by spacebeluga @ 08:51:41 on Jul 09
I still don't get this. WHY are they now "two facing" on the Romulan popularity? They blamed its low popularity on Nemesis and NOW they are going to use them again? This makes NO sense whatsoever.
Another thing I want to know is WHY is Berman doing another movie? I thought he said he was working with 3 other directors. WHY is he attempting to write it? The guy can't write a decent movie script if his life depended on it. He was rumored to be FIRED after March sweeps. This is ridiculous. Tell him to go do his stupid blue marble crap and just fucking leave Trek alone.
That Eugenics comment better not be tied into ENT because they happened in the 1990s NOT Archers time.
I wonder if Berman and Braga have a big poster of George Lucas on the wall next to their beds. Which they pray to every night with the hopes of actually coming up with an "original idea".
Star Trek XI=Berman production= ANOTHER bomb!
It's pretty clear I'm alone when saying I'm looking forward to all this new stuff.
Berman and Braga hating the Romulans? I DON'T THINK SO!! Not only are they going to feature the Romulan Wars, it will be the next movie! KICK ASS!!!
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TREKMAN: The MAN Who Knows His TREK
Sit down, shut up, and just watch the show!
...fuctioning well enough to put out this one last message:
This man scares me in the same way George W. Bush scares me. Not to say that it is of the same magnitude or importance, but it is the same manner of thinking. It's the feeling that something I know and love is being destroyed and there's nothing I can do to stop it.
I didn't want to start a political discussion (and I sincerely hope I didn't just alienate a significant portion of posters reading this), but I felt that was the best way to describe what I feel whenever I read an update on Berman's new movie.
Now...I'm not going to scream. I'm a civilized human being.
How...fucking...stupid...is he...?
Nemesis, a movie based on what was once the most popular syndicated show on television, failed horribly at the box office.
Now he wants to do a prequel movie with characters that nobody has ever heard of? Rather than cursing, I'm simply not going to even make the attempt at expressing how insanely idiotic this is.
Has he not humiliated Star Trek enough? Does he not feel important enough in the world? Must he spit in Star Trek's face and gaze on in satisfaction as the rest of the world laughs as it squirms out of existence? No, he has to make another failure...Sorry computer, you're dead after this post...
So it's going to be about the Romulan War, huh? Great, one more important event of Star Trek history about to be abused and disgraced. I'm a huge fan of the Romulans. It was bad enough that Nemesis destroyed all the political and social intrigue that had been building up at a painfully slow pace for the past decade or so...now he has to fulfill his Temporal Cold War promise and destroy the Romulans in the past as well.
Which brings me to another point: Berman had said that one of the reasons Nemesis failed was because the fans supposedly were tired of the Romulans. So WHO THE HELL DOES HE THINKG HE IS??? Now he suddenly decides that fans want to see the Romulans? Or better yet, maybe he thinks that all those casual viewers who didn't want to see a TNG movie but want to see a completely irrelevant ST movie want to see the Romulans! The man is a fucking genius!
Quote:
"One thing we're discussing is possibly blowing the lid off the Temporal Cold War once and for all," according to the excerpts. "That's probably something we'll do in this first storyline. I can't say that for sure, because we're just getting into it. But I'd really like to resolve that and put a cap on it. It would be a nice thing to do after three seasons of teasing it along."
My GOD!!! Braga knows NOTHING!!! The Temporal Cold War is supposedly the thing that made ENT unique in the beginning. It was the last argument for people who were trying to prove that ENT is unique. And now he's thinking about ending it??? Just like that??? "Oh, it's an annoyance now, so we'll get rid of it." The man is an incompetant jerk!
Quote:
Apparently he also says that major "intersterllar events" that lead to the founding of the Federation may take place this year, and hinted at something involving the famed Eugenics Wars.
My mind cannot begin to concieve of the horrors that are the possible excuses to link the founding of the Federation to the Eugenics War.
Quote:
This should be treated as rumor until confirmed.
Steve, if you're still reading at this point, are you saying here that the quotes you provided might be false?
EDIT: For the record, the Bush metaphor was more or less a joke, as comparing an Evil TV producer to a (possibly) evil US President is slightly on the nutty side...
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Kor: You of the Federation, you are much like us.
Kirk: We're nothing like you. We're a democratic body.
Kor: Come now Captain, I'm not referring to minor ideological differences. I mean that we are similar as a species. Here we are on a planet of sheep, two tigers, predators, hunters... killers. And it is precisely that which makes us great. And there is a universe to be taken.
--Commander Kor of the Klingon Empire, on the United States of America
RE: My computer, which has just become a punching bag, is still...
by Sxottlan @ 02:25:36 on Jul 14
RE: My computer, which has just become a punching bag, is still...
by Bashir666 @ 09:20:05 on Jul 09
RE: My computer, which has just become a punching bag, is still...
by spacebeluga @ 09:25:45 on Jul 09
RE: My computer, which has just become a punching bag, is still...
by ShadowTalon @ 03:51:47 on Jul 09
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by spacebeluga @ 08:37:13 on Jul 09
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by ShadowTalon @ 01:54:41 on Jul 10
RE: My computer, which has just become a punching bag, is still...
by spacebeluga @ 11:00:03 on Jul 10
RE: My computer, which has just become a punching bag, is still...
by Scorned @ 01:09:49 on Jul 09
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by Prowlerz @ 01:07:17 on Jul 09
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by spacebeluga @ 08:49:09 on Jul 09
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by Prowlerz @ 01:07:04 on Jul 09
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by Rational Voice @ 00:36:27 on Jul 09
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by CMBat @ 00:51:55 on Jul 09
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by Rhett Quacklah @ 17:30:13 on Jul 09
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by Nightslayer @ 08:22:24 on Jul 09
RE: My computer, which has just become a punching bag, is still...
by spacebeluga @ 00:40:42 on Jul 09
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by c.p. @ 16:09:01 on Jul 10
RE: My computer, which has just become a punching bag, is still...
by Steve Krutzler @ 00:35:47 on Jul 09
RE: My computer, which has just become a punching bag, is still...
by spacebeluga @ 00:43:14 on Jul 09
RE: My computer, which has just become a punching bag, is still...
by odomovie @ 23:46:49 on Jul 08
Honestly, they need to take a break. Let Enterprise finish its run, then let Trek rest.
Star Trek isn't popular right now because it has yet to show its life. Right now it seems old and stale. The only way you can bring it back is to give it the old energy that it used to have. That means you bring in someone new. It means you'll have to reinvent it possibly. And it means you get rid of everyone that was associated with ENT, VOY, DS9, TNG, and whoever else.
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Resistance is futile.....if less than 1 ohm
The Eugenics wars might be talked about, but it doesn't mean B&B intend for them to take place during ENT.
About the movie, I CAN'T WAIT! Oh, but wait. Some here will post about how bad of a movie its going to be b4 they even see it....
And they call themselves "true Trek fans". Too bad....
While I'm pleased to hear that the Romulan War (not Wars) is a possible feature film, I bet B&B still manage to screw it up. In case they read this, here's a couple of points:
1. It was the Earth/Romulan War, not a war between the Federation and the Romulans.
2. Do yourselves a favor and watch the Original Series episode Balance of Terror.
From above:
Apparently he also says that major "intersterllar events" that lead to the founding of the Federation may take place this year, and hinted at something involving the famed Eugenics Wars.
WHAT?
Has Braga WATCHED TOS "Space Seed"? Has he WATCHED TWoK?
The Eugenics Wars supposedly HAPPEN in the 1990s and rather than keep to that time frame, they have summarily screwed around with it per ENT "Hatchery", effectively shoving it into the timeframe of WW III in the mid 2000s.
How are we going to "see" this? What else. TIme travel. Or a flashback I suppose.
I know what Scorned is going to say... LOL
(aside from mention of a potential ripoff of "Star Wars: Attack of the Clones"... 
)
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"I think the show talked to people through the characters. They're stories that speak to the heart. They talk about love, they talk about friendship, they talk about loyalty, they talk about patriotism, exploration, curiosity, reaching out... And I think all those things still touch people. Even when you look at a 30-year old show, it still has something to say." - D.C. Fontana, Sci Fi Channel Special Edition TOS 1998
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Outer Space. The last frontier.
These are the trips of the Star Trek Enterprise.
Its 5-year plan...
Calls for us to explore strange new worlds. To seek out new life and new civilizations.
To boldly fly where no man has gone in space.
Patrick Stewart on SNL 2/5/94
RE: Huh?
by Sxottlan @ 01:48:39 on Jul 09
RE: Huh?
by Jadzia-Dax @ 07:45:53 on Jul 09
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by Sxottlan @ 20:54:55 on Jul 13
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by TREKMAN: The MAN Who Knows His TREK @ 00:03:52 on Jul 09
RE: Huh?
by Scorned @ 12:44:54 on Jul 09
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by TREKMAN: The MAN Who Knows His TREK @ 14:04:19 on Jul 09
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by Jadzia-Dax @ 07:50:03 on Jul 09
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by TREKMAN: The MAN Who Knows His TREK @ 12:30:33 on Jul 09
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by Jadzia-Dax @ 20:15:55 on Jul 09
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by odomovie @ 23:19:03 on Jul 08
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by spacebeluga @ 23:42:51 on Jul 08
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by TRexx @ 00:25:03 on Jul 09
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by Jadzia-Dax @ 07:34:02 on Jul 09
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by odomovie @ 23:41:58 on Jul 08
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by spacebeluga @ 08:45:56 on Jul 09
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by spacebeluga @ 11:59:53 on Jul 09
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by Jadzia-Dax @ 12:12:48 on Jul 09
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by chris_h @ 10:03:08 on Jul 09
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by Jadzia-Dax @ 12:00:19 on Jul 09
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by spacebeluga @ 11:48:08 on Jul 09
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