Repititiousness wasn't the problem | Report this post to moderator
By: Reklaw (Odo's file, contact) @ 11:12:57 on Jun 14, 2004

I doubt it was the repetitiousness of the conflict scenes between the main characters. I'm surprised to say it, because I've always been a big fan of Patrick Stewart, but there were too many silly scenes in Nemesis, too many with him. The one near the beginning set the pace as far as I'm concerned: Picard driving that stupid dune buggy like vehicle just seemed ludicrous - like a Patrick Stewart indulging himself on his vacation home video.

I'm starting to agree with many of the voices on this board that Trek is getting very tired. Every time I see them waste money on yet another dumb plot in the Star Trek movie series, I'm wistful for something like the Wrath of Khan. Most of the movies have been like parodies of Trek, or worse, Galaxy Quest.

The first two seasons of ENT actually seemed to me to be an interesting tangent from the overly child oriented content of DS9 and, to a lesser extent, VOY. Although season three had a couple really great eps, it was generally a big turn for the worse - IMO. I'm also very pessimistic about season four based on the season 3 finale. No doubt 80+% rated it very good or better on this site but I really thought it stunk.

Anyway, I have my fingers crossed. But if ENT dies or just gets as boring for me as DS9 generally was, I'll seek refuge in Japanese dramas - I've become a real Japanese drama slut of late. I might even be able to focus more on work instead of watching ENT reruns! ;) I might even get productive enough to be worth what they pay me - now that would be


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'Shaka when the walls fell'
Tamarian Captain - 'Darmok'

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If they had only waited until January ... | Report this post to moderator
By: ety3 (Odo's file, contact) @ 08:57:00 on Jun 14, 2004

... or even February, perhaps Nemesis could have had a bigger take -- despite its flaws. But, Paramount released it right after the new Bond film and The Two Towers.

At least Frakes is taking it seriously and not saying something as asinine as "I guess fans hate Romulans."

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Too much on the two characters.. | Report this post to moderator
By: Michael Kirk (Odo's file, contact) @ 01:39:55 on Jun 13, 2004

I agree that they DID not focus on the characters as they have done in the past.I may be wrong(and probably am)that it seemed this movie ,and Inserection seemed to be more about Data and Picard,and from what I remember they wanted influence on the story....did not ask Frakes who directed some of the most popular episodes when it was on T.V.?,....as a friend always told me Sumthin's up?

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the clown can stay,but the ferengi in the gorilla suit has to go

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Too much on the two characters.. | Report this post to moderator
By: Michael Kirk (Odo's file, contact) @ 01:39:43 on Jun 13, 2004

I agree that they DID not focus on the characters as they have done in the past.I may be wrong(and probably am)that it seemed this movie ,and Inserection seemed to be more about Data and Picard,and from what I remember they wanted influence on the story....did not ask Frakes who directed some of the most popular episodes when it was on T.V.?,....as a friend always told me Sumthin's up?

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the clown can stay,but the ferengi in the gorilla suit has to go

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I have it all figured out(don't we all) | Report this post to moderator
By: mohap (Odo's file, contact) @ 21:02:41 on Jun 12, 2004

They need to do two things with this franchise:

1) Wait a long time and build up anticipation and hunger for Trek.

2) When they finally do, don't screw it up like they did with STAR WARS.

DONE. Simple, isn't it?

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I appreciate that Frakes was trying to be honest, however... | Report this post to moderator
By: spacebeluga (Odo's file, contact) @ 10:00:01 on Jun 12, 2004

Quote:
And over the years, long acting scenes in the STAR TREK movies never seemed to help the movies, and NEMESIS had more than a few long acting scenes."

I don't think he knows what he's talking about here. The Wrath of Khan had many long dialogue scenes, and they were all perfect. I suppose the other films were a bit faster paced, but they all get srength from the dialogue (Kirk and Spock in TUC, Lily Sloane and Picard in FC, etc). The two times I saw Nemesis the pacing was always quick. It was a fast paced film that sacrificed an interesting story and interesting characters for the sake of action. And THAT is where the problem lies.

But I still thank Frakes for trying to be honest about the film.

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Kor: You of the Federation, you are much like us.



Kirk: We're nothing like you. We're a democratic body.



Kor: Come now Captain, I'm not referring to minor ideological differences. I mean that we are similar as a species. Here we are on a planet of sheep, two tigers, predators, hunters... killers. And it is precisely that which makes us great. And there is a universe to be taken.



--Commander Kor of the Klingon Empire, on the United States of America

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Not just long scenes | Report this post to moderator
By: Scorpius (Odo's file, contact) @ 07:16:12 on Jun 12, 2004

It wasn't just long scenes that hurt the movie. Long scenes are fine as long as they are driven by conflict. First Contact had numerous dialogue scenes from the end of the Deflector fight to the confrontation with the Queen, but it was kept interesting by having Picard in conflict with Worf and his own morals.

We had Picard just TALKING to Shinzon several times. There was no conflict between them until he kidnapped Picard, and even then Picard was restrained.

There were also major flaws with the B9 subplot -- namely they simply reactivate him with no second thought or security precautions, without learning from their experience with Lore. Are the crew THAT dumb?

The best part of the movie was that the Romulan Senator was played by Jim Robinson from Australian soap Neighbourrs, and died in the same manner that Jim Robinson did in the show.

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"Men don't use sex to get what they want. Sex IS what they want" - Frasier

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I agree with Frakes | Report this post to moderator
By: Falcor5 (Odo's file, contact) @ 17:50:14 on Jun 11, 2004

I really think if Frakes had directed Nemesis it would have helped the movie alot. Insurrection was not the greatest script but it still was very well directed and you could tell Frakes was getting the most out of what he was givin. I agree 100% with his comments about the flow and slow pacing of the movie. Also I agree that there was just not enough character moments with the cast alot of them where cut by Baird where as frakes may have left some of them in and got rid of alot of the repeating parts with Picard and Shinzon talking about being "the same".

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Wish he'd comment about Baird | Report this post to moderator
By: Greenspan (Odo's file, contact) @ 16:47:56 on Jun 11, 2004

Frakes was absolutely correct. There are too many scenes where people just stand around talking and it slows the film down. And how many times can we have scenes where Picard tells Shinzon that he can be a better man. And like he said, no one was anxious to see Nemesis. When the trailers came on, people groaned and said, "Not another Star Trek movie."

I wish he talked more about Baird as a director. Frakes wasn't a great director, but at least he understood the Star Trek concept and the characters and knew how to keep things moving along. Bringing in an outsider is good since it brings a fresh perspective. But get someone who'll do his homework. Harve Bennett knew nothing about Star Trek when he was hired to produce Star Trek II, but at least he took the time to go watch all the episodes of TOS. Did Baird even bother watching TNG reruns?

Berman had the right idea in finally bringing in outside talent. Too bad he picked the wrong people. He got a director too lazy to familiarize himself with the source material and a writer who was too much of a fanboy.

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"Maybe in another thousand years, we'll have teleportation and all that other Star Trek stuff. But with our current technology, we can't even make William Shatner's hair look real." --- Bill Maher

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Honest remarks | Report this post to moderator
By: BWilliams (Odo's file, contact, web site) @ 15:43:50 on Jun 11, 2004

Jonathan Frakes sounds honest about NEMESIS' failure and at peace with the fact that he's played Riker for the last time. That's the way to look at it, realistically and openly.

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